General Chat Thread, The French are mad... in General; OMG localzuk, we are in total agreement for once!
"When in Rome..." pretty much sums my view up - hence ...
11th April 2011, 04:12 PM #16
OMG localzuk, we are in total agreement for once!
"When in Rome..." pretty much sums my view up - hence why I believe anyone who goes to live in Spain, France, etc should actually bother to learn the language and integrate into their culture.
A massive part of how we identify people is by their face, this is the same across the entire world and has been for all of history - we as a species are the only species to have evolved such a wide diversity of faces and facial gestures. As said hoodies are banned in a lot of places, so are bike helmets, so are balaclavas... and as it is a cultural belief and not a religious one why should veils be any different?
That is before you get onto the oppression of women. Many say it isn't oppression, but that they choose to do it. I'll bet that if you asked many women back 200 year ago if they felt oppressed by not having a vote they would answer no, it still doesn't make it right though.
Thanks to j17sparky from:
ButterflyMoon (11th April 2011)
IDG Tech News
11th April 2011, 04:37 PM #17
A child when it is born recognises its parents by their faces so it is apparent that to all human beings seeing other peoples faces gives us all the confidence to approach that person, if that person is masked by whatever then our childhood upbringing tells us that something is not right with this scenario and therefore we feel uncomfortable with it and so avoid confrontation as in the flight syndrome or we confront as in the fight syndrome which is a basic animal instinct which we all have.
It would therefore be in everyone's interest if only to allow each other to understand and fully integrate with one another as a full multicultural society the fact that we could greet each other face to face in a modern cultural experience.
Its not a racist thing its old culture and with the world becoming smaller by the second it is a culture which hinders all the world from fully integrating and being as one nation "The Human Race"
Thanks to bossman from:
akidosaint (12th April 2011)
11th April 2011, 04:50 PM #18
Don't think this issue is as big as it is being made to be, us jocks have had to forfeit the skein dhu as part of the highland dress due to the offensive weapons act. I cannot for the life of me remember an outcry.
Thanks to andyturpie from:
ButterflyMoon (12th April 2011)
11th April 2011, 05:02 PM #19
Are you sure about that?
Originally Posted by andyturpie
11th April 2011, 05:04 PM #20
Taken from: Criminal Justice Act 1988
139Offence of having article with blade or point in public place
(1)Subject to subsections (4) and (5) below, any person who has an article to which this section applies with him in a public place shall be guilty of an offence.
(2)Subject to subsection (3) below, this section applies to any article which has a blade or is sharply pointed except a folding pocketknife.
(3)This section applies to a folding pocketknife if the cutting edge of its blade exceeds 3 inches.
(4)It shall be a defence for a person charged with an offence under this section to prove that he had good reason or lawful authority for having the article with him in a public place.
(5)Without prejudice to the generality of subsection (4) above, it shall be a defence for a person charged with an offence under this section to prove that he had the article with him—
(a)for use at work;
(b)for religious reasons; or
(c)as part of any national costume.
11th April 2011, 05:09 PM #21
I can't remember the burning of the St George's cross in protest to that decision.
11th April 2011, 05:27 PM #22
Wot's it say about a Jedi and his light sabre???
Originally Posted by plexer
11th April 2011, 05:29 PM #23
The French are strong in the belief that society should be integrated and "French". That is what is at the root of their decision; in which light it makes perfect sense. Whether it will work, or cause friction, is another question.
11th April 2011, 05:43 PM #24
Liberté, Égalité, Fraternité, ou la Mort - certains sont plus égaux que d'autres.
Originally Posted by beeswax
Last edited by somabc; 11th April 2011 at 06:31 PM.
11th April 2011, 06:12 PM #25
Liberty, Equality, Fraternity, or Death , some are more equal than others...could not agree more.
French however are massively patriotic, and its not just the veil they banned, they gave the view, if one is banned, ALL are banned. You cant wear a skullcap if you are jewish unless in a synagogue, you cant publicly show the cross, or have a bindi if you are hindu (outside of religious ceremonies).
That is a sensible decision in banning it for all so that nobody can pull out the "religious oppression" card, and THAT the driving force behind the decision.
11th April 2011, 06:27 PM #26
What on earth has that got to do with the point at issue? What countries do or don't do in the name of Islam or whatever is irrelevant - my point was that it is NOT a religious requirement to wear a veil and therefore banning it is NOT anti - religious.
Originally Posted by Gibbo
11th April 2011, 06:30 PM #27
France has actually really being putting it's neck on the line in defense of Human Rights recently in Libya and now in the Ivory Coast.
BBC News - Ivory Coast: Gbagbo held after French troops move in
Besieged Ivorian leader Laurent Gbagbo has been detained in the main city Abidjan and delivered to the headquarters of his elected successor. He reportedly surrendered to Alassane Ouattara's forces after French tanks advanced on his residence. Mr Gbagbo had been refusing to cede power to Mr Ouattara after losing November's presidential election. France said pro-Ouattara troops had detained him, but aides to Mr Gbagbo said it was French special forces. As they closed in on Mr Gbagbo's power base in Abidjan, UN and French attack helicopters targeted heavy weapons being used by his forces. Attempts to negotiate his exit failed, and his forces appeared to be making a comeback by the end of last week, even threatening the hotel used by Mr Ouattara. On Sunday, UN and French helicopters launched a new wave of air strikes, and on Monday French tanks were seen advancing on the residence.
11th April 2011, 06:54 PM #28
It doesn't state specific religious dress so if that's what yours is and it's recognised then go forth
Originally Posted by Busybub
11th April 2011, 08:32 PM #29
I can't argue with that, you're right of course. Though I will add, not as an attempt to have the last word on this, that "Liberté, Égalité, Fraternité" tend to be the words seen on most, if not all, French public buildings. And I fell for that line.
Originally Posted by somabc
11th April 2011, 10:34 PM #30
Interesting point, I take it that they were all banned at the same time and strangely, the veil is the only one to get media attention. Most faiths will just "get on with it" and accept. A few will still play the victim card -cue the flag burning and the embassy attacks.
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