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General Chat Thread, ICT teaching hits the dust in General; Originally Posted by tech_guy Did you hear that some of the cheaper tablets in the states have a bit of ...
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    MK-2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tech_guy View Post
    Did you hear that some of the cheaper tablets in the states have a bit of a problem. They come shipped with adult content - a porn bundle. A few people on xmas day weren't happy when their kids opened them and discovered the little extras.
    which ones??????????????????????

    you know, purely so i dont buy the wrong ones.....just being cautious.............

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    somabc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rydra View Post
    10 years ago, ICT was a young subject
    10 years ago? So 2001? I think ICT was hardly young then? There has been Computing since the 1950's and in Schools since the 1970's/80's? I can certainly remember computing lessons in the 1980's and 1990's!

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    Think its meant that 10 years ago IT was geeky shall we say, now MSN is used by all youngsters, they have Bebo, Facebook and nearly every house hold has PC+Internet
    Even parents and people that dont have a clue with IT are getting laptops and PCs.

    Yet 10 years ago it was only us in the IT business or actually "needed" it not just for play or to join the world, online shopping has gone through the roof, ebay. I can go on

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    somabc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mthomas08 View Post
    Think its meant that 10 years ago IT was geeky shall we say, now MSN is used by all youngsters, they have Bebo, Facebook and nearly every house hold has PC+Internet
    Even parents and people that dont have a clue with IT are getting laptops and PCs.

    Yet 10 years ago it was only us in the IT business or actually "needed" it not just for play or to join the world, online shopping has gone through the roof, ebay. I can go on
    Again I'd argue PC / Internet use was widespread 10 years ago, I'm sure it was longer than that when I had Tesco first deliver groceries over the internet. Millions of people used the internet and PC's before the millennium. Amazon, Ebay, BBC News, Google, Napster, the 'Dot Com' Boom all happened before 2000.

    http://www.statistics.gov.uk/pdfdir/int0301.pdf
    Last edited by somabc; 20th January 2011 at 12:26 PM.

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    jdoyle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by somabc View Post
    10 years ago? So 2001? I think ICT was hardly young then? There has been Computing since the 1950's and in Schools since the 1970's/80's? I can certainly remember computing lessons in the 1980's and 1990's!
    when I was a lad blah blah blah.... Left Wootton Bassett school in 1979 without seeing or knowing what a computer was. First intro to IT was 1981(?) at Swindon College, 2 SuperBrains running CPM off 8inch floppy discs and a beastie in a room with teletypes and paper tape.

    Can't believe how successive govts keep messing about with education with no real results. Can see GCSE forlock tugging on the agenda shortly; all us lower order plebs need to know our places don't yer know..

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    alan-d's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elsiegee40 View Post
    This whole curriculum review by the government is plain daft.

    They have already stated that they want all schools to become Academies...

    Academies have freedom from the National Curriculum.

    Why bother messing with the National Curriculum?
    Because the people whose job it is to play with the National Curriculum have suddenly realised that if all schools become academies then they will be out of a job, so they are making themselves infalible by saying that the National Curriculum needs fixing.

    It's a bit like one of us taking a win 95 machine apart for something to do because the new win 7 machines don't need mainenance (OK bad example but you get the gist )
    Last edited by alan-d; 20th January 2011 at 12:56 PM.

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    36Degrees's Avatar
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    The other issue is which teacher is actually taking that lesson shoud ICT be cross-curricular. Several here don't have the ICT skills themselves so expecting them to teach others is a huge case of "the blind leading the blind" and even those that are reasonably literate would still class as "the partially sighted leading the blind". Also, teachers in other faculties use ICT as tools to teach their subject, how many of them would be prepared to teach pupils the ICT skills first or at the same time?

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    GrumbleDook's Avatar
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    This is where the skills v knowledge argument starts again. With a little bit of support between departments, teachers who do not have the required skills in particular areas can still help other subjects make the most of things. A geography field trip in yr7 collects information about a variety of things ... not just limited to geography. They might collect information about the grounds they are in (ie the history of the estate, the previous usage as farmland, etc), the wildlife in the area (the types and quantities of insects and birds) and so on.

    They get back to school and the ICT Department use the trip to help generate a flyer, dealing with DTP, which can they be followed through by Art. Science then use the data about animals to look at migration, habitats, the food chain, etc.

    In year 8 Maths can take the same data to work through probability, mean/median/mode, as well as taking any use of graphs by Geography and perfecting it ... which then feeds into a unit by science ... and so on.

    With a bit of planning you can stretch information and hone skills.

    This can happen very simply in many schools and most primary schools are rather good at this. It is quite embarrassing that I can go into lots of primary schools and talk about this vertical learning of knowledge and skills ... and they get it. I speak to secondary schools and the departments are in silos and don't talk to one another.

    How many secondary schools have sat down and looked at what primary schools teach? How many have a decent programme of work to get skills and knowledge up to speed (not just in ICT but in other subjects too)?

    As IT Managers, NMs, Techies in secondary schools I would expect you to ask your feeder schools what software they use and what for, so that you can help departments prepare for when the new kids into year 7. You might be surprised about what some of them learn ... and it is not taught by ICT specialists either.

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    jdoyle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrumbleDook View Post
    How many secondary schools have sat down and looked at what primary schools teach? How many have a decent programme of work to get skills and knowledge up to speed (not just in ICT but in other subjects too)?

    As IT Managers, NMs, Techies in secondary schools I would expect you to ask your feeder schools what software they use and what for, so that you can help departments prepare for when the new kids into year 7. You might be surprised about what some of them learn ... and it is not taught by ICT specialists either.
    Happy to say we're on the ball here. Lots of contact with our feeders by teachers (ICT, Maths, DT, Science, PE, English, , MFL, Gifted&Talented etc) and our tech team do the hardware/software installs at the primary schools. Lots of transition support starting in year 5.

    Did a couple of years as a parent governor at a primary and was impressed at how well organised they were (schemes of work, lesson plans etc). Less impressed by what I see from many secondary teachers.

  10. Thanks to jdoyle from:

    GrumbleDook (20th January 2011)

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    tech_guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MK-2 View Post
    which ones??????????????????????

    you know, purely so i dont buy the wrong ones.....just being cautious.............
    Just do a Google search for 'android tablet from colby came preloaded with' and you'll find the story. It was a Kyros Tablet.

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    clareq's Avatar
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    Teaching secondary school students discrete ICT is a little like setting aside a couple of hours a week to teach them how to use a pen. My husband is Network Manager at a nearby school and teaches ICT to all Y7 students. All he teaches in the first term is how to save a file, with a sensible file name, how to ensure the content of a document is correct before you apply fonts etc. and how to use a help file or google to find out how to use a unfamiliar piece of software. ground work which stands them in good stead for the rest of their school career.

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    36Degrees's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrumbleDook View Post
    As IT Managers, NMs, Techies in secondary schools I would expect you to ask your feeder schools what software they use and what for, so that you can help departments prepare for when the new kids into year 7.
    An excellent idea and in all honesty not something I'd thought about but makes perfect sense. My issue with that on a personal basis is the age old one of resources, especially time. There is myself as NM and one tech to do everything which means there aren't enough hours in the day. When I get chance to speak to the head of ICT I will definitely discuss it with her.

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    I went into Upper school (3 tier system) in 98, and ICT was offered for the first time as a GCSE only the year before. At middle school (94-98), I used a computer maybe 4 hours a term, in the 2nd 2 years... before that was even less, barely a couple of hours.
    Lower school age, we had I think 2 computers in the whole school (outside of admin)!

    Considering they released win 95, which was a complete revamp/rework compared to Win 3.11... Most schools didn't leave win3.1 till win 98SE was released, though a few had 95 machines, they were rarely networked at this point.

    Internet didn't really hit schools till the late 90's, as most teachers didn't know what it was, let alone what to do with it. The internet boom was 98-2000 really, when it really started kicking off.

    The school's network in 98 was Win3.11 based. The NM/technician was an antiquated old woman who really didn't know what she was doing... likely a librarian who got stuck with a computer, and inherited it. One ICT teacher who was a domain admin used to not have a password, and logged in students as herself occasionally.
    The other was just an idiot, and used to ask the STUDENTS questions on how to do things.... And if you ever did something you shouldn't he'd get you to show him what you did, and he'd take notes on it!!!

    By the time i got to A levels, I had our newly trained and appointed ICT teacher exclaim "wow I didn't know you could do that!" when I opened Windows explorer in Windows 2000 by right clicking on the start menu...

    I literally picked up my bag and walked out of that lesson, and never went back after that (it was "Key Skills ICT" and was clear that I knew more than the teacher did before entering the classroom)

    So yes, I comfortably say that 10 years ago, as far as education is concerned, ICT was in it's infancy. but 10 years ago was windows 2k release, and windows and it's core features/usage hasn't changed in methods in 10 years, just added new ones and tweaked old ones.
    The WAY we access computers changes all the time, and as such teaching will always be something that the teacher has to retrain for. You never stop learning.

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    somabc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rydra View Post
    Considering they released win 95, which was a complete revamp/rework compared to Win 3.11... Most schools didn't leave win3.1 till win 98SE was released, though a few had 95 machines, they were rarely networked at this point.
    It really depends on the school and the equipment they used. For example my school used mainly Macs and the internet was common in classrooms from 94/95 even if only over dial up. It should not matter which O/S the school was using to Teach, you can still learn on any version of windows, linux, mac, acorn whatever. I know people that learned C on RiscOS for example.

    Internet didn't really hit schools till the late 90's, as most teachers didn't know what it was, let alone what to do with it. The internet boom was 98-2000 really, when it really started kicking off.
    It may be different depending on your age and perspective but I would say there was an Internet Boom in the 1970's with Unix and Email / Usenet in Universities then another boom in the early 90's with the Web and Netscape around 93 onwards that we are still enjoying.


    I literally picked up my bag and walked out of that lesson, and never went back after that (it was "Key Skills ICT" and was clear that I knew more than the teacher did before entering the classroom)
    This is the fault of ICT = how to use Word thinking.
    I think we need more courses like this Kelso High School, Scottish Borders - Computing

    (PS Intermediate / Higher Computing is roughly a mixture of GCSE and some A-Level in ability ie. 15/16/17 years old).

    There was an interesting report on ICT in Schools in Scotland, ie outside the National Curriculum.
    http://www.hmie.gov.uk/documents/pub...iseictilat.pdf
    Last edited by somabc; 20th January 2011 at 05:53 PM.

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    Perhaps it would be good to teach I.C.T specifics. Get specialists in or train teachers to specialise in some areas of I.C.T. Doubt there would be a demand for that though.

    I.C.T is to broad of a subject. You have DBAS, PM's, Business Intelligence, Architecture, I.T. Admins, Infastructure/Networking/, Coders etc. Some form of I.T. needs to in education at some level other than teaching excel, word etc. What good is teaching how to build a rubbish website in dreamweaver.

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