+ Post New Thread
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 23
General Chat Thread, Public sector pensions facing 'reform' aka. 'the chop' in General; It has long been accepted in the public sector that whilst our pay is generally lower than that of our ...
  1. #1

    localzuk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Minehead
    Posts
    17,694
    Thank Post
    516
    Thanked 2,455 Times in 1,899 Posts
    Blog Entries
    24
    Rep Power
    833

    Public sector pensions facing 'reform' aka. 'the chop'

    It has long been accepted in the public sector that whilst our pay is generally lower than that of our private sector colleagues, we make up for that difference with a decent benefits package - pensions, holidays etc...

    It seems that the government now thinks it is unfair to be paying us public sector workers a fair wage, and also its unfair to be giving us a decent retirement plan.

    I'm only 25 and I'm worried about this. What is the point of accepting much lower pay than in industry to work in the public sector, if we get s****d over every time the government needs a couple of quid?

    Sure, I accept that we need to cut our deficit, but there are plenty of areas where this can be done, without completely messing up the future of those people who keep the government and its departments running.

    Its a bit depressing really...

    BBC News - Public sector pension costs 'to double in five years'

  2. #2
    nicholab's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Birmingham
    Posts
    1,494
    Thank Post
    4
    Thanked 97 Times in 93 Posts
    Blog Entries
    1
    Rep Power
    50
    It more to do with civil service pensions which are gold plated and protected. The difficult thing I faced thought was that the old pension scheme my employer was only putting in 6% put with the LGPS they put in 20%. It is also to do with how the pension scheme is run is not your pension your paying for but the a person who is currently retired.

  3. #3

    broc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    England
    Posts
    2,046
    Thank Post
    104
    Thanked 401 Times in 265 Posts
    Rep Power
    150
    As I understand it, not all Govt pension schemes are properly funded & backed by investments & assets, some are funded from Govt revenue and these costs will be directly affected by an increase in the number of people retiring. A properly funded pension scheme has assets that is managed to provide funds when they are needed, private sector pension funds end up with 'holes' in them because employers take holidays from making their contributions when the investment funds do well & complain when the funds don't do well & they have to make up the shortfall.

    Unfortunately all 'public' sector workers are tarred with the same brush. I believe all(most?) local government workers pensions are properly funded. I am not sure if the teachers pension is.... I believe it wasn't in the past.

    The average local government pension is around £4000 pa, hardly gold-plated......

  4. #4


    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,105
    Thank Post
    256
    Thanked 450 Times in 251 Posts
    Rep Power
    141
    Don't know how many people know this, but with the LGPS, as long as you put into it for the next 25 or however many years, you can be a street cleaner earning £8,000 a year for those 25 years. But if in the 26th year you become the director for cleaning services earning 85,000, you can take early retirement that year (assuming no contracts tying you for longer) and you'd get a pension based on that last year, not on the 25 years of input beforehand.
    Why else do you think so many of the highest ranking jobs are held by, shall we say, those who are 'close to retirement'

  5. #5

    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    London
    Posts
    3,156
    Thank Post
    116
    Thanked 529 Times in 452 Posts
    Blog Entries
    2
    Rep Power
    124
    Quote Originally Posted by Rydra View Post
    Don't know how many people know this, but with the LGPS, as long as you put into it for the next 25 or however many years, you can be a street cleaner earning £8,000 a year for those 25 years. But if in the 26th year you become the director for cleaning services earning 85,000, you can take early retirement that year (assuming no contracts tying you for longer) and you'd get a pension based on that last year, not on the 25 years of input beforehand.
    Why else do you think so many of the highest ranking jobs are held by, shall we say, those who are 'close to retirement'
    That's not completely true - eg in the teacher scheme the pension is based on the salary for the last 3 years and it's similar in a lot of other schemes.

    It's also unrealistic to suggest that there are going to be many street cleaners who will have spent 25 years as a cleaner and will magically become director of cleaning services for the final year of their career (particularly as most of the street cleaning services are outsourced anyway!)

    Finally, if you look at any organisation, private or public, you'll find that the highest ranking jobs are held by those who are closer to retirement - it's pretty rare for someone to get a job as director at the age of 21 and then work their way down the management chain until they retire!!

    What we ought to be saying is not "how dreadful, public sector workers get a reasonable pension - we must take it away from them" but "how dreadful, private sector workers get a very poor pension - how can we make sure they get a better pension"

  6. #6

    broc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    England
    Posts
    2,046
    Thank Post
    104
    Thanked 401 Times in 265 Posts
    Rep Power
    150
    Quote Originally Posted by srochford View Post
    What we ought to be saying is not "how dreadful, public sector workers get a reasonable pension - we must take it away from them" but "how dreadful, private sector workers get a very poor pension - how can we make sure they get a better pension"
    Entirely agree with you; unfortunately the message seems to be "We (private sector workers) have been stitched up by our employers, so the public sector workers deserve stitching up too."

  7. #7

    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Watford
    Posts
    876
    Thank Post
    381
    Thanked 114 Times in 73 Posts
    Rep Power
    62
    It gets my goat this schizzle between private and public sectors. The BBC have your say is rife with people who attack the public sector. Its common knowledge that public sector jobs are lower paid and pensions are higher, but people forget they have EVERY oppertunity to decide which sector they want to work in and if they choose private then thats completely their choice to do so. My opinion is that the financial crisis was created by the private sector and the public sector are the very first to be targeted.

  8. #8

    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Watford
    Posts
    876
    Thank Post
    381
    Thanked 114 Times in 73 Posts
    Rep Power
    62
    Also, we had large class devide under thatcher in the 70s and 80s. Are we now going down the same road using different terms for it?

  9. #9
    AyatollahPies's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Earth
    Posts
    900
    Thank Post
    48
    Thanked 105 Times in 95 Posts
    Rep Power
    42
    I'm sorry, but these days public sector pay is on a par, or better than the equivalent in the private sector, especially in IT Support.

    However, I agree that just because the private sector pensions have been destroyed, that is no reason to turn on those in the public sector.

  10. #10

    SpuffMonkey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    2,236
    Thank Post
    55
    Thanked 278 Times in 186 Posts
    Rep Power
    134
    Quote Originally Posted by broc View Post
    Entirely agree with you; unfortunately the message seems to be "We (private sector workers) have been stitched up by our employers, so the public sector workers deserve stitching up too."
    Agree with you there - I got scr**ed over twice in the private sector - once by the firm and once by the pension provider, so last time I was made redundant I opted to take a lower paid job but a safe pension (given I was then over 40 and had little provision. I will be seriously dischuffed to get b*ggered about again simply to cough up my pension to ensure that the bankers don't have to pay their fair whack (anyone else watch Dispatches last night with Will Hutton?)

  11. #11
    sandeep2504's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Surrey
    Posts
    245
    Thank Post
    47
    Thanked 21 Times in 20 Posts
    Rep Power
    17
    I've been giving serious thought to stopping my pension payments and using an ISA as an pension pot.

    currently in LGPS.

    i just don't trust the government with my money and at retirement don't want to be shafted over.

    do you guys still think its worth?

  12. #12

    elsiegee40's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Kent
    Posts
    11,090
    Thank Post
    1,796
    Thanked 2,198 Times in 1,625 Posts
    Rep Power
    775
    I work in the private sector having worked in the public sector and, in terms of pay and conditions, the public sector gets a better deal.

    Formal payscales - annual increments - annual pay rises - they're all part and parcel of working for state schools.

    In private schools, particularly in these credit crunch times, our Bursars govern their fee income with a rod of iron. Spending does not come easily on anything unless it's to impress prospective parents!

    I went 3 years here before I got a pay rise.

  13. #13


    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,105
    Thank Post
    256
    Thanked 450 Times in 251 Posts
    Rep Power
    141
    Quote Originally Posted by AyatollahPies View Post
    I'm sorry, but these days public sector pay is on a par, or better than the equivalent in the private sector, especially in IT Support.

    However, I agree that just because the private sector pensions have been destroyed, that is no reason to turn on those in the public sector.
    This is not quite true.

    Though with some fields it is hard to actually find a private equivalent, private earn a lot more than public sector.

    My dad works for local government, after he was made redundant. He took a 15,000 paycut, doing the same work.
    Myself, I can earn 2-5,000 more by working on a helpdesk doing nothing but answer phone calls all day. I know this, because I was OFFERED the job, only to be turned it down when the manager got my CV, as I had TOO MUCH experience. He wanted someone who would be willing to work for a few years, and decided i was overqualified, and likely to get bored within 3-6 months.
    Private sector wise, I could earn the best part of 8-10k more than I earn now, even working within education (such as for a support company) than I do now, for literally the same job.

    A teacher working for a private school will earn considerably more than they will working for a public state school as well.

  14. #14

    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Watford
    Posts
    876
    Thank Post
    381
    Thanked 114 Times in 73 Posts
    Rep Power
    62
    Quote Originally Posted by AyatollahPies View Post
    I'm sorry, but these days public sector pay is on a par, or better than the equivalent in the private sector, especially in IT Support.

    However, I agree that just because the private sector pensions have been destroyed, that is no reason to turn on those in the public sector.
    I would disagree with the on par or better, but the margin is getting smaller. Just look at IT recruitment websites and you can still see a 5-7k difference in some roles. But that maybe down to the individual company wanting to take someone on and look to retain rather than keep having to re advertise and re interview at extra cost when people take flight

  15. #15


    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,105
    Thank Post
    256
    Thanked 450 Times in 251 Posts
    Rep Power
    141
    The difference is, I work in a school, they will always need IT support of some sort. Working for any other company, there is no guarantee how long till they win/lose business, or decide to move or downsize, plus a lot have pensions tied to investment schemes, so you are taking a gamble. I have family who have lost tens of thousands of pounds in invested money into these pensions.

SHARE:
+ Post New Thread
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Do you prefer working in the public or private sector?
    By sonofsanta in forum General Chat
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 6th March 2010, 10:29 PM
  2. Public sector employees to get ripped off, again
    By localzuk in forum General Chat
    Replies: 94
    Last Post: 14th December 2009, 02:51 PM
  3. Public Sector workers discounts
    By laputa01 in forum General Chat
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: 21st April 2009, 01:12 PM
  4. Replies: 16
    Last Post: 25th February 2008, 04:14 PM
  5. Deal on public sector pensions
    By russdev in forum General Chat
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 18th October 2005, 09:18 PM

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •