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General Chat Thread, Fuel prices - brace yourselves in General; 10 days ago it was 109.9 at the garage I use. As I drove past this morning it was 113.9....
  1. #46
    36Degrees's Avatar
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    10 days ago it was 109.9 at the garage I use. As I drove past this morning it was 113.9.

  2. #47

    tmcd35's Avatar
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    I often wonder how meny garages/oil companies use stories like this and/or iminant tax hikes as an excuse to rise price anyway? Also do the prices ever actualy go down? Yes over a week or two a couple of pence may come off the price but if we looked at a graph for 6months/year/10years I recon the trend is only in one direction......greed.

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    torledo's Avatar
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    And fuel duty is supposed to go up by 3p come april 1st.

    that'll be popular.

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    There has to be a breaking point for consumers at some stage maybe £1.50?

    I think the goverment know no one is going to protest so they know they can continue to increase taxes every budget.

    I drove past one petrol station sunday near roehampton it was was 113p and five mins down the road on the a3 at another station it was 118p.

    Start a facebook protest group as it seems to be the only way that people take notice these days.

  5. #50

    Dos_Box's Avatar
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    The other thign to consider about oil reserves is that there is still a LOT of oil out there. What is lacking are teh resources to discover and exploit it. Many major oil companies will also get cagy when asked about their reserves as they 'sit' on oil fields without exploiting them. This too keeps oil prices high. It took over 10 years to get the Falklands oil fields explored simply due to the lack of exploration equipment. Ther is also a silly rounour going around that the conflict in 1982 was about oil. It was not, in fact the govt was looking at the possibility of offloading the Falklands to Argentina at the time.
    But we do need to break the dependancy on oil as a transportation fuel source, I just wish govts would do it with a degree of thought. Whats the point in taxing people more as an envirmoental tax when for many there is no alternative, when a well thought out international agreement to phase in alternative fuel based vehicles over say 25 years matched by the increased tax on fossil transport fuel, would mean car manufaturers would be compelled to develop said vehicles whilst the poorest in society would not be hammered quite so hard before the older model 'green' cars filter down to them.

  6. #51
    dgsmith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpuffMonkey View Post
    Whereabouts is that forecourt - I'm up that way in a few days & could do with a cheap(ish) fill up!
    Tesco in Litherland, Merseyside was 111.9 on Sunday. They seem to be keeping it as low as possible to put the other station across the road out of business (as this Tesco was only built late last year).

    Most stations otherwise around here are 113.9 now though.

  7. #52
    torledo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jinnantonnix View Post
    That's business. Many people cannot cut back, as it's essential for work, and the things they need to do day to day. Fuel for transport is an oddity - the normal price vs demand theory doesn't quite follow. People will cut back on other things first.

    Let's no forget that the biggest earners are the govt. Even if the oil companies gave away petrol for free, the duty would be about 50p/l. And you can add VAT on top of that.
    i agree. i certainly use the car 'cos i have to....i do walk short distances where possible, but i'm not a cycler and it's not practical for me to walk or cycle long distances for the things i need to do that require me to use the car. Whether fuel is at 1.50 or 1.00 i can't cut back. i'm not going to waste money on a bus pass or alternate transport arrangements unless i'm to be reimbursed.

    i'll make cutbacks elsewhere, or i'll find a motor that does more MPG as and when, but that's not a decision i'd make if/when fuel goes over £1.50.

    to be honest if people didn't pish their money up the wall on all sorts of useless junk and pointless waste of their moderate salaries then most people who commute within their town/city would absorb the fuel rises.....it's just so many people's finances are ridiculously stretched inspite of Zero% effective interest rates. But i guess higher cost of living in other areas may compel people to cut out some discretionary spending.

  8. #53
    fiendishlyclever's Avatar
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    There are a number of issues that all contribute to the problem.

    When I was a teenager we had one car which we used very little (we got our first car when I was about 10). We didn't need driving a mile to school, and we thought nothing of walking to the shops. My parents worked fairly locally and used a primitive contraption called a bicycle to get from A to B.

    Out of town shopping and leisure has contributed. Today as car technology has improved there is an abundance of cheap old cars so ownership costs are much lower. People see a car as essential and drive everywhere (schools at hometime illustrate this well) hence the increase in waist lines. We have multiple cars per household so this problem multiplies.

    The solution? Taxing petrol doesn't stop the occasional driver who just drives a few miles to school and back.

    I'm known for my radical views on the subject - I'd ban all cars over a certain age and increase road fund tax to a much higher level. Increasing the cost of car ownership is the only way we'll tackle this problem - not just by taxing fuel. Sure we'll have to tighten our belts for a while but then people might start to adapt, work locally, walk to school etc. I don't think my party would ever get into power with policies like that!

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    Quote Originally Posted by fiendishlyclever View Post
    There are a number of issues that all contribute to the problem.

    When I was a teenager we had one car which we used very little (we got our first car when I was about 10). We didn't need driving a mile to school, and we thought nothing of walking to the shops. My parents worked fairly locally and used a primitive contraption called a bicycle to get from A to B.

    Out of town shopping and leisure has contributed. Today as car technology has improved there is an abundance of cheap old cars so ownership costs are much lower. People see a car as essential and drive everywhere (schools at hometime illustrate this well) hence the increase in waist lines. We have multiple cars per household so this problem multiplies.

    The solution? Taxing petrol doesn't stop the occasional driver who just drives a few miles to school and back.

    I'm known for my radical views on the subject - I'd ban all cars over a certain age and increase road fund tax to a much higher level. Increasing the cost of car ownership is the only way we'll tackle this problem - not just by taxing fuel. Sure we'll have to tighten our belts for a while but then people might start to adapt, work locally, walk to school etc. I don't think my party would ever get into power with policies like that!
    What about all the millions of people who work a LONG way from home, the structure of this country does not allow for everyone to work in the town they live in its just far too crowded, inflated prices in cities mean that people can't live there and instead its cheaper to commute.

    There is no perfect solution to any of this, but one way of making people feel better is to make them feel like they are more in control of their own money, and adding MORE taxes which then get pushed into the pile of wasted public sector projects is just not a good way of doing it.

  10. #55
    torledo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fiendishlyclever View Post
    There are a number of issues that all contribute to the problem.

    When I was a teenager we had one car which we used very little (we got our first car when I was about 10). We didn't need driving a mile to school, and we thought nothing of walking to the shops. My parents worked fairly locally and used a primitive contraption called a bicycle to get from A to B.

    Out of town shopping and leisure has contributed. Today as car technology has improved there is an abundance of cheap old cars so ownership costs are much lower. People see a car as essential and drive everywhere (schools at hometime illustrate this well) hence the increase in waist lines. We have multiple cars per household so this problem multiplies.

    The solution? Taxing petrol doesn't stop the occasional driver who just drives a few miles to school and back.

    I'm known for my radical views on the subject - I'd ban all cars over a certain age and increase road fund tax to a much higher level. Increasing the cost of car ownership is the only way we'll tackle this problem - not just by taxing fuel. Sure we'll have to tighten our belts for a while but then people might start to adapt, work locally, walk to school etc. I don't think my party would ever get into power with policies like that!
    but apparently the cost of used cars is actually going UP. So coupled with rising fuel prices, road fund and MOT costs which don't go down, i'm not sure the cost of running a car more so the convenience that encourages it's use.

    unfortunately the 'tax the car' strategy always fails to address the issues with alternative means of transport and the lack of an integrated public transport system that can even come close to the convenience of using the car.

  11. #56

    maniac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fiendishlyclever View Post
    I'm known for my radical views on the subject - I'd ban all cars over a certain age and increase road fund tax to a much higher level. Increasing the cost of car ownership is the only way we'll tackle this problem - not just by taxing fuel. Sure we'll have to tighten our belts for a while but then people might start to adapt, work locally, walk to school etc. I don't think my party would ever get into power with policies like that!
    That prices people like me out of the market then. The only way I can afford to own a car is by buying a 15yr old banger for £350 and running it for as long as possible (Current car is a Vauxhall Cavalier that I've owned for 3 yrs now - cost £350) Then you get onto the environmental impact of making a new car vs the environmental impact of running an old one etc. etc.

    I don't think that is the ultimate answer, the real solution is finding a viable alturnative to petrol for fuel, and sinking significant investment into it to make it attractive to consumers.

  12. #57
    36Degrees's Avatar
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    I'd love a more economical car but the one I own is mine - to buy another one would mean spending money I don't have.

    I'd love to work closer to where I live - I did for about 16 months and then the company I worked for starting making redundancies.

    My wife would love to work closer to where we live but she was made redundant at Christmas - her only option is travel further or be unemployed.

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