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    ICT_GUY's Avatar
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    Everything that is wrong with the justice system/

    Company director arrested for attempted murder after rescuing son being beaten by yobs | Mail Online

    If you're in England and you fend off multiple assailants at your home with a letter opener, you'll be charged with attempted murder. (fark tag)

    A company director has been arrested on suspicion of attempted murder after confronting a gang of yobs who were attacking his stepson.

    Colin Philpott, 58, allegedly stabbed a 16-year-old in the chest during the incident in the front garden of his £500,000 Tudor-style house.

    He had awoken late on Friday night to discover stepson Alex Lee being beaten by the group of teenagers.

    Read more: Company director arrested for attempted murder after rescuing son being beaten by yobs | Mail Online
    Mr Lee, 25, had gone outside to stop the gang from vandalising Mr Philpott’s Jaguar car. Mr Lee was said to have then been punched and kicked in the head, suffering a broken nose and concussion for which he needed hospital treatment.

    Speaking after his release on bail, his stepfather Mr Philpott, who owns an escalator cleaning company, described how he had gone downstairs to find the gang on the doorstep.

    'I was asleep and I awoke to hear a noise outside. When I appeared at the door I was set upon by them, as a result of which one of the youths received several stab wounds,' he said

    'My wife appeared and I asked her to call the police and the ambulance service. They arrived shortly afterwards and I was arrested.

    'It was traumatic but I was very well treated by the police. I have to return to the police station in September.

    'At the moment I am not too worried about it but has been difficult, particularly for my wife, I must say.'

    He went on to claim his Jaguar had been vandalised on a number of occasions and youths often congregated in the area.

    Mr Philpott's wife Susanne, 51, had earlier described how her husband had rushed out to defend her son with a letter-opener he had grabbed from a shelf. It was then that the teenager was allegedly stabbed five times. He was taken to hospital and was last night said to be stable.

    When police arrived at the five-bedroom house in Crowthorne, Berkshire, Mr Philpott was arrested on suspicion of attempted murder. Five youths, aged 16 and 17, were arrested on suspicion of assault and criminal damage.

    Mrs Philpott said: ‘My son and I came out at about 11pm after hearing a bang and we saw two young guys outside our house.

    ‘They returned 15 minutes later – with three others – and all were visibly drunk. I took a digital camera and told them that if they vandalised anything else I’d take pictures as evidence.

    ‘One said that he would kill me and burn down my house. I was terrified and when Alex tried to calm him down, the other four got worked up and they all attacked him. Alex ended up on the ground with all five of them on him, kicking him in the head and stomach. I was so frightened for him that I screamed for Colin, who was in bed.

    ‘He came running out – still barefoot and half asleep – and saw the mess Alex was in so ran back into the house. He grabbed the first thing he saw, which was a letter-opener, and confronted the boys.

    ‘They attacked Colin and I saw one stumble into the road as Colin screamed for me to call the police. When the police arrived and then arrested Colin, I was gob-smacked.

    ‘It was heartbreaking to see him handcuffed and carted off like a common criminal. He is a hardworking, honest family man and was only trying to protect us.’

    The mother of two, who works as a training consultant, said the quiet neighbourhood had been blighted by teenagers attacking cars and defacing gardens for several months.

    Read more: Company director arrested for attempted murder after rescuing son being beaten by yobs | Mail Online

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    3s-gtech's Avatar
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    If the case is as reported (is that likely from the Daily Fail?) that's a pretty clear self defence case, though whether it was entirely proportionate is not clear. Would be interesting to see what the CPS do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 3s-gtech View Post
    If the case is as reported (is that likely from the Daily Fail?) that's a pretty clear self defence case, though whether it was entirely proportionate is not clear. Would be interesting to see what the CPS do.
    Self-defense isn't a charge though, its a defense. He will still be guilty of attempted murder, or of Grevious Bodily Harm, depending on the circumstances but claiming self-defense should let him go without penalty.

    Claiming self-defense will not stop you being arrested, or even charged. It will stop you suffering the full consequences of your actions under the law, since you were protecting yourself, but it does not make you less guilty of the offense committed.

    Therefore the police did exactly what they were supposed to do and I wouldn't fault them for it. They arrested everyone involved where evidence pointed towards them having committed a crime. Whether its worth actually pressing charges, and appropriate to do so, is a matter for the CPS, not a matter for the officers on scene.

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    ICT_GUY's Avatar
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    I think its pretty much never ok to stab someone in self defence in this country, like its not ok to shoot people with guns no matter what.

    The problem being that the police are not there to protect you as a citizen, they are only there to deter crime and to mop up afterwards. It is every citizens duty to protect themselves and their loved ones from harm using any force necessary, it is a very recent development where the populace are constantly being told that they should not defend themselves, or that they should be measured in their response.

    I am not talking about beating up criminals, but of the fact that when you are threatened the only thing you should have to worry about is making sure that you are safe and that the bad guy goes away.

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    Daily Mail - wipe your bum with it, more poo poo will come off the paper.
    'Nuff said.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jamesb View Post
    Self-defense isn't a charge though, its a defense.
    This, I know. The legal case would probably be GBH (as the police will probably arrest on a more serious charge, and go for a lower offence on CPS consultation). If the self defence position is sufficiently clear, the CPS will decide there is no case (or at least, no point in taking it to court).

    You're correct, the cops there did nothing wrong at all - he clearly (seriosuly) injured someone, so there are reasonable grounds to arrest him, self defence or not. I'm a bit rusty, but we covered all this in training

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    I once caught some scum bag breaking in to my house through the roof window. I naturally helped him down with a good tug on his leg.... you can guess what happend next.

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    Lets hope the CPS use their brains for once, or the judge throws it right out. Would be a travesty of justice otherwise. Yet another case of the liberal left giving more rights to the criminal, and sod all to the decent people in this society.

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    I suppose it all rides upon whether or not his actions can be interpreted as using reasonable force.

    Apparently, we can't just punch, kick, headbutt, shoot or stab someone just because they attacked us first but, you can use reasonable force to protect yourself if you feel that your life is in danger.... so, I guess stabbing someone five times with a letter opener will be seen by the CPS as unreasonable.

    The police in this case have done their job - some of those officers may just silently approve of what happened! - and it is now up to some odd folk sitting behind desks to make a decision to prosecute or not.

    I'm going to find myself a description of what is deemed as "reasonable force" now

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    localzuk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamesb View Post
    Self-defense isn't a charge though, its a defense. He will still be guilty of attempted murder, or of Grevious Bodily Harm, depending on the circumstances but claiming self-defense should let him go without penalty.

    Claiming self-defense will not stop you being arrested, or even charged. It will stop you suffering the full consequences of your actions under the law, since you were protecting yourself, but it does not make you less guilty of the offense committed.

    Therefore the police did exactly what they were supposed to do and I wouldn't fault them for it. They arrested everyone involved where evidence pointed towards them having committed a crime. Whether its worth actually pressing charges, and appropriate to do so, is a matter for the CPS, not a matter for the officers on scene.
    Sorry James but you're a little bit wrong there.

    UK law allows for self-defence as a defence in court. If the judge (or jury) decides that it was self defence, you would be acquitted. This means you are not guilty of the charge, not that you are guilty but aren't going to be punished for it.

    Also, take into account that there are 2 definitions of self-defence in UK law. Namely the common law definition:

    At common law the defence has existed for centuries and permits a person to use reasonable force to:

    defend himself from attack
    prevent an attack on another person
    defend his property
    and Section 3 of the Criminal Law Act 1967

    "A person may use such force as is reasonable in the circumstances in the prevention of crime, or in effecting or assisting in the lawful arrest of offenders or suspected offenders or of persons unlawfully at large."
    So, whatever the reason for the arrest, or the charge, the court will take this into consideration, and I'd be surprised if they weren't acquitted.
    Last edited by localzuk; 27th July 2009 at 10:26 AM.

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    localzuk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diello View Post
    Lets hope the CPS use their brains for once, or the judge throws it right out. Would be a travesty of justice otherwise. Yet another case of the liberal left giving more rights to the criminal, and sod all to the decent people in this society.
    If the person has been charged, then the CPS has agreed that there is reason to take them to court. The police don't make the decision to charge themselves.

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    Reasonable force is a very recent idea. My idea of reasonable force when in danger is anything that allows me to walk away from said scum bag in one piece.

    Criminals volunteer for injury when they attack someone. The poor bugger on the receiving end does not have that choice.

    As an aside the local rag ran a piece on the terrible loss of a father due to a bad batch of smack doing the rounds. Beggars belief.

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    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    UK law allows for self-defence as a defence in court. If the judge (or jury) decides that it was self defence, you would be acquitted. This means you are not guilty of the charge, not that you are guilty but aren't going to be punished for it.
    I was close at least.

    I've noticed that in a lot of papers they seem to believe that 'charged with' and 'arrested under suspicion of' are the same thing. I wonder if that's the case here? (Can't read the article as I'm at work at the moment)

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    localzuk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamesb View Post
    I was close at least.

    I've noticed that in a lot of papers they seem to believe that 'charged with' and 'arrested under suspicion of' are the same thing. I wonder if that's the case here? (Can't read the article as I'm at work at the moment)
    The article itself doesn't actually mention charges except that there may be some in the future. He's simply been arrested and bailed to return to the police station.

    The op is the one who mentioned charges, wrongly it seems.

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