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General Chat Thread, who has more say?... in General; Network Manager or ICT Coordinator who's been doing it way before there was a full time support...... I know i've ...
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    Little-Miss's Avatar
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    who has more say?...

    Network Manager or ICT Coordinator who's been doing it way before there was a full time support......

    I know i've only been at my current school 6 months but im getting frustrated because there is so much i want to change but havent had a chance to and have a feeling that its not going to be an easy job..

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    SYNACK's Avatar
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    It probably won't be an easy or quick job, it takes time to build up a good level of trust and respect in a new place especially if you are competeing with others who have been around longer. You need to build a good working releationship with the decision makers and power brokers in the school and get them used to the idea of you being right.

    If something is not the right call even if you are going to be overridden anyway make it clear politely and proffesionally that this (insert better option) is the way that you recommend and preffer. If and when their bad choice comes back to bite them make sure to gently remind them of your initial objections. This if done right gets them into the habbit of admiting that you make the right call. Eventually as respect for and trust in your ideas grow you will end up with a lot more say. Unfourtunatlly a lot of it comes down to dirty, dirty politics. In that regard I have often thought that The Prince by Niccolò Machiavelli - Project Gutenberg should be prescription reading for any network manager simply to provide a template upon which to interpret and identify the games that are in play. (It is not an easy read though as it is translated to english rather than written in it).

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    Little-Miss (26th February 2009)

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    fiendishlyclever's Avatar
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    I would say it depends on what you want to change.

    Teaching related things - him
    Network, security, infrastructure - you
    hardware purchases, office software - you get locked in the server room and not let out until you agree.

    More details plx

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    Little-Miss (26th February 2009)

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    Diello's Avatar
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    The Prince by Niccolò Machiavelli - Copy 3 feet away from me on my bookshelf!! Great book...

    It also depends on Job Descriptions and Terms of Reference. What is the ICT Co-ord's job? Are they your Line Manager? If so, is that in an oversight, or day-to-day micro-management role? Does your JD state that you're the primary manager for developments in consultation with the SLT, or that your role is merely to advise the ICT Co-ord, and the job of development ideas is primarily theirs?

    SYNACK is right, it's about politics and power plays unfortunately. There are two types of ICT Co-ords when they've had previous say in technical developments - 1) the ones who did it because the SLT wanted them too, and they're happy to accept that you're a professional, and bow to your greater knowledge, because you're the professional - 2) the ones who, regardless if they actually have a clue or not, want the recognition, and you'll have to pry control from their cold, dead, fingers. They'd much prefer for you to do the hard graft, and them get the credit. There's no getting away from this, but JD as mentioned above certainly gives you a step up the ladder.

    A lot also comes down to the SLT - If they have an active interest in ICT being a success, they'll listen to you a lot more - If they don't, they'll want to hand it off to another teacher, and let them deal with it.

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    Little-Miss (26th February 2009)

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    localzuk's Avatar
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    IMO, the 2 have completely different roles, and if the ICT Co-ordinator is involved in the technical side of things, and is a teacher, the school may be breaking various rules.

    A NM should have more say in regards to technical implementation of ideas. ICT Co-ordinator is more about curriculum usage of ICT. So they will come up with the ideas, and you implement them once instructed to by the SMT/your manager. They certainly should not have much say about actual implementation.

    But as Synack says, these things take time. I didn't think about changing the school's plans until 6 months after I had been there. And then my ideas took at least another 6 months to come to fruition.

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    Little-Miss (26th February 2009)

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    Surely the NM should be providing the resources for the ICT teachers to do their job. So, in theory, the HoICT calls the shots. But it should be a working relationship.

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    Little-Miss (26th February 2009)

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    localzuk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by laserblazer View Post
    Surely the NM should be providing the resources for the ICT teachers to do their job. So, in theory, the HoICT calls the shots. But it should be a working relationship.
    It might be like our school, where we don't have a head of ICT. Just me and the ICT Co-ordinator.

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    Little-Miss's Avatar
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    Well, you've all basically said what i was thinking...

    Unfortunately it looks like im going to have to be patient. I get on with my line manager, its just obviously going to take a while before im allowed to make any major changes. I probably need to well, excuse my language....grow some balls lol!! (more a courage then a gender thing lol!!)

    Today got me thinking when he sat down and told me where to put the new printers we having coming in and feeling like i didnt really get a say in it....petty i know, but i think im just feeling frustrated because ICT is so poor there that im constantly fire fighting instead of being asked what i think could help.

    Im not out of line to ask to see his development plan and he curriculum am i? I'm completely in the dark...

    You're right Localzuk, its a primary school so its only me and him...

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    localzuk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little-Miss View Post
    Im not out of line to ask to see his development plan and he curriculum am i? I'm completely in the dark...
    No you're not. But phrase it 'the school's ICT dev plan'.

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    Little-Miss (26th February 2009)

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    somabc's Avatar
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    The Prince is very useful and certainly applies to many areas in life, however it may be wise to try and work with the Co-ordinator first to see if they are reasonable. If you have good ideas and a vision for the Schools ICT plan then SMT will come round.

    I never the understood the role of ICT Co-ordinator at least in terms of how it relates to the NM. I had a line manager who was an 'uber' NM ie covered a large no of schools overall, but that was a very handsoff role. We would only meet every few months and there was no attempt to lay down 'policy'. Under my contract I was also answerable directly to the Head Teacher in terms of operations and ensuring all services were working properly so in a sense he was also my line manager. Then there was the ICT Co-ordinator responsible for teaching needs of ICT and of course the Head of the ICT Dept (a teacher) who would like to make 'suggestions' to the ICT co-coordinator. So it is perfectly possible to have 3-4 people who think they are each in the driving seat with ICT

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    Little-Miss (26th February 2009)

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    SYNACK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little-Miss View Post
    petty i know, but i think im just feeling frustrated because ICT is so poor there that im constantly fire fighting instead of being asked what i think could help.

    Im not out of line to ask to see his development plan and he curriculum am i? I'm completely in the dark...

    You're right Localzuk, its a primary school so its only me and him...
    I think that you may need to get used to being a bit more proactive, think about the things that bug you about the network and put them in writing for your own planning. Look at the problems and work out how they affect the users, this is your case for action. Then look for good robust solutions to solve or alleviate those problems and put them into a nice shiny, colourful and simple report outlining what the problem is (breifly), how this affects the users and how much it would cost to fix it. You then take this to the or managment and present the case, if it is a tricky sell at first this is where you need to get the power brokers on your side agitating for it too. Not everything will get through but managment like being presented with solutions rather than problems.

    You are definately within your rights and job description to ask what the ICT Co-ordinators plans and goals are. I would approach it in a more casual way asking for a meeting to discuss what his goals are so that you know the direction the school is taking. This way you can integrate your problem solving with the schools goals and will get the ICT Co-ordinator helping push things through. It also gives you the opertunity to provide input and direction on the technical aspects depending on what type of person he is (1 or 2 from above).

    Primary schools are tricky when it comes to who reports to who sometimes. In my job role I report to the head directly that way I can handle the infrastructure stuff and the ICT Leader can handle the EDU stuff. I would not say that the NM should report to or be subordinate though. They are there to provide a solid foundation to build upon, what if the ICT Co-ord went and spent all of the money on laptops and left no cash of infrastructure. This is where the seporation comes in and why the NM should have power in their own right to make sure that they can do their job.

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    Little-Miss (26th February 2009)

  20. #12

    Little-Miss's Avatar
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    .....i love you guys! lol

    Thanks..

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    somabc's Avatar
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    If it does come down to the two of you being rivals as such then remember who controls the money, or at least has the influence of the person who signs off the money will have the upper hand in developing new projects .

    "Part of your job is figuring out what your boss is good at and what your boss is bad at, and asking your boss for help with things that your boss is good at, and politely giving your boss help with the things your boss is bad at."

  22. #14

    Little-Miss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by somabc View Post
    If it does come down to the two of you being rivals as such then remember who controls the money, or at least has the influence of the person who signs off the money will have the upper hand in developing new projects .
    I love that quote. I shall remember that!

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    I have an ICT co-ordinator who hates ICT.



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