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General Chat Thread, Makes you proud to be British....... in General; BBC NEWS | Magazine | 'Working, what's the point?'...
  1. #1

    mattx's Avatar
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    Makes you proud to be British.......


  2. #2
    gwendes's Avatar
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    How sad. They're lazy but I'm guessing there isn't much to be positive about in that situation.

  3. #3
    alexknight's Avatar
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    Total waste of space

    What a total waste of space some people are.

    My take home pay from the council is very near £1000 a month, take all my cost of living expanses from that and I would have less in my pocket than they have.

    When will the government wake up???

    Alex

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    DrPerceptron's Avatar
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    What were they expecting with no qualifications?

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    mattx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gwendes View Post
    How sad. They're lazy but I'm guessing there isn't much to be positive about in that situation.
    They seem positive about watching Telly or getting on the Telly.....
    They should do some voluntary work or find out about gaining some extra skills than just thinking the country owes them a living......

  6. #6


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    Before people cast judgement i think they should take into consideration that the people in question live in an area of massive unemployment, the highest in the UK i believe. And that the govt. make it so damn hard to get any money out of the social that once you are on it it would be silly to give it up for any old temp work.

    I am not however condoning people who dont work. But at the same time if i had stayed on the dole for 3 years i would have been no worse off than what i was before i got my current job; doing a week here, getting layed off, spending 6 weeks with no money, getting another temp job for a month, getting layed off... If i had lived on my own i woudl have found it very hard to pay the bills, nevermind feed myself.

    So to say "you should just get any job rather than stay on the dole" is a very simplist view, and in alot of cases you will end up worse off financially .
    Last edited by j17sparky; 14th January 2009 at 01:30 PM.

  7. Thanks to j17sparky from:

    _Bat_ (14th January 2009)

  8. #7

    mattx's Avatar
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    They seem to have enough money for a mobile phone, jewelry, fags & spending in Cafe's. But they can't afford to go on the bus to look for work......
    Hmmmmmm.

  9. 6 Thanks to mattx:

    bossman (14th January 2009), OutToLunch (14th January 2009), stratisphere (14th January 2009), stu (14th January 2009), tech_guy (14th January 2009), webman (14th January 2009)

  10. #8


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    Quote Originally Posted by mattx View Post
    They should do some voluntary work or find out about gaining some extra skills than just thinking the country owes them a living......
    I agree but it isnt as simple as that. IME trying to gain extra skills while on the dole i nigh on impossible. When i told the dole i would be doing an NVQ all they had to say was "why? Get a job you lazy person...". They didnt seem to realise that by retraining it would ultimately be in both our interests

    Im not sure but i dare say that you cant do voluntry work while on job seekers, as you arnt "seeking a job".

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    apoth0r's Avatar
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    I spend £80 a month on my bus fare, thats 8% of my wages, but you have to do it? If you don't pay to get to work you don't work do you? It's common sense.

    I've been out of work many times, i have never signed on out of principle. Maybe I should have and played the "haven't found a job I like yet" card. It's work, it's not gonna be that fun!?!?

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    gwendes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrPerceptron View Post
    What were they expecting with no qualifications?
    I think you'd need to have been to their school, lived in their area etc to understand if that was as simple as it sounds.

    I've lived in a thoroughly rough area and done the agency work in factories that they have - it's soul destroying. Being sent home because there was a mistake at the agency, working double -shifts or night then afternoon for £100-150 a week...

    I agree there should be something for them to do - something to make themselves employable but that's a matter for government. Some people make their own success but living in a situation like that everyday can really make you feel like giving up.

  13. Thanks to gwendes from:

    _Bat_ (14th January 2009)

  14. #11

    Gatt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattx View Post
    They seem to have enough money for a mobile phone, jewelry, fags & spending in Cafe's. But they can't afford to go on the bus to look for work......
    Hmmmmmm.
    Makes you wonder..

    if they stopped the ciggies that would save them - what £5 to £6 a day each!

    Will let them have the Mobiles ( £10 a month on O2 gets you 300 free txts and £10 worth of calls)

    the Jewellery and Cafe visits would prob save them a fair bit too..

    Both get about £95 a fortnight - they'll no doubt be on just about every benefit under the sun (Low Income, Council Tax, Most bills paid for, etc etc ) so that money is going where exactly?

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    torledo's Avatar
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    Sparky is absolutely spot on about high unemployment in areas which have lost major industries and the lack if financial incentives and prospects in full-time work.

    There is a serious point to be made, which is that it's basically a numbers game. IF your single and on unemployment benefit there are all sorts of oncosts that are available for nowt (even more so if you have
    kids).....housing benefit (now called LHA), council tax benefit and several others that i don't have the inclinaiton to mention right here.

    Your only going to walk into low paid work without qualifications and work experience, so why bust a gut and risk losing entitlement to those means tested benefits.....there are websites that tell you how much you get in handouts through employment.....so if the work your applying for doesn't 'add up' in terms of paying the required working tax credits (WTC) or means you don't get full concession on things like council tax what is the point in getting up at 8:00 in the morning to do a dead end job ?

    And before you all hurry to answer, i know self-esteem and pride are good enough reasons, but the point is nulabour don't make it easy for people to progress in employment......there's a dead-end built into the system. If you start on a job and after a couple of year you become stuck in that band where you earn too much and at the same time too little you really are basically being screwed over. Tax credits was supposed to encourage peope into shelf stacking and dead end jobs but it's bascially been a farce riddled with fraud from the start.

    This pair are nothing, 1 year and 3 year on JSA ?? Pfft. The real problem cases are those who've spent years on incapacity with 'bad backs', single parents who've never had to look for a job even when their offspring reach secondary school age (we're talking over a decade on incapacity and income support for a lot of cases), and these cases and the reliance on the welfare state is only going to get worse as jobs go left, right and centre in the 'real' economy.

  16. #13

    webman's Avatar
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    If he was so desperate to work, he wouldn't avoid the "factory jobs" that he doesn't seem to like. It can't be that bad - like mattx said - they have plenty of jewellery, phones, TV, computer, tobacco...

    It's not the country's fault or the government's fault they have no qualifications - if it was, everyone at their school would have left with no qualifications.

  17. #14


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    Quote Originally Posted by gwendes View Post
    I think you'd need to have been to their school, lived in their area etc to understand if that was as simple as it sounds.

    I've lived in a thoroughly rough area and done the agency work in factories that they have - it's soul destroying. Being sent home because there was a mistake at the agency, working double -shifts or night then afternoon for £100-150 a week...

    I agree there should be something for them to do - something to make themselves employable but that's a matter for government. Some people make their own success but living in a situation like that everyday can really make you feel like giving up.
    Well said.

    Quote Originally Posted by mattx View Post
    They seem to have enough money for a mobile phone, jewelry, fags & spending in Cafe's. But they can't afford to go on the bus to look for work......
    Hmmmmmm.
    A week tripper is around 30% of their weekly "wage" so you can understand if they dont want to go to town, spending what little money they have, only to be knocked back.


    I think people forget that once you are out of work it is far harder to get a job. Plus if you live on your own, you're on the dole, your bills are getting payed, you have food in the cupboards... You then go and get a job, it lasts a week and then you get layed off, you then have 6weeks+ before the dole gives you any money. What do you do for those 6weeks? Not eat? Not pay teh council tax, your rates, your rent... And how exactly do you go looking for work when you have no money to pay the bus driver?


    Sorry rant over, but i hate the very simplist view some people have based on the fact they have been brought up in a good area with plenty of opportunities...
    Last edited by j17sparky; 14th January 2009 at 01:53 PM.

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  19. #15
    Butuz's Avatar
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    Personally I think it's the system to blame rather than the people.

    Although I have never been unemployed myself, I have seen first hand how actually you can be better off not having a job at all! As long as this is the case, and the system is so floored - why would people want to try and get jobs that will actually make them considerably worse off???

    NO idea how to fix it mind..

    Butuz

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