Poll: Will you be striking?

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General Chat Thread, Strike in General; Exactly any gain this year will be eaten by the lost pay. Unison never think ahead as i said above, ...
  1. #31
    cookie_monster's Avatar
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    Exactly any gain this year will be eaten by the lost pay. Unison never think ahead as i said above, I think a better approach as the government don't have any money is to tell them what will happen next year to give them time to plan and budget for a better offer.

  2. #32
    leco's Avatar
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    Reasons

    I could get very political and start quoting National and Local Government election statistics as a discussion point. Can National Government be disregarded because of a lack of a ballot paper? Can Local Government be ignored by not voting? The answer is of course no to both.

    I may not agree with my National or Local Government representatives but, how ever they were elected, I am obliged to follow the rules. It could be argued that being a member of an organisation I am also obliged to follow the rules of that organisation. This however, is slightly different as I do have a choice, but in all conscience can I pick and choose which rules I follow and which I do not?

    I am not working today for a variety of reasons, but one of those reasons is that others are not in a position to be able to strike. For instance I am extremely grateful that the people caring for my mother-in-law are working today. I understand the dilemmas being faced, I also think that a claim for 6. whatever it is will not be successful. But if nothing is said or done then nothing will get done - the lowest paid will continue to be lowly paid whilst other "more important" people are awarded ever increasing percentages.

    This is the first time in my long working life that I have taken industrial action, I am not happy about it but hope that in some way my small voice will be heard.

  3. #33
    cookie_monster's Avatar
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    I could get very political and start quoting National and Local Government election statistics as a discussion point.
    No don't that will just highlight the negative problems of low turnout


    This is the first time in my long working life that I have taken industrial action, I am not happy about it but hope that in some way my small voice will be heard.
    I have taken action before but i believe that now is not the time and the low turn out suggests that plenty of others agree.
    Last edited by cookie_monster; 16th July 2008 at 11:47 AM.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gatt View Post
    Ok lets get one thing clear

    I am in Unison but im not striking because....

    1) I didn't ge a ballot paper
    2) only 13 PERCENT of Unison members voted, out of that only 55 PERCENT said "yes - we'll strike" - now my maths isn't great but thats what - about 7.5 percent (give or take) of Unison Members?
    3) Most Importantly... Like most other people here, I have Bills to pay each month, I also have to feed my family - (Me, My Wife, my 14 Month old son, and 2 dogs).. I can ONLY JUST do this on a full months pay... If I lose 2 days pay - I will NOT be able to pay all my bills or even buy food..

    Number 3 is the primary reason I am not striking - i just cannot afford to..

    Now if you lot who say we should be striking "cos everyone else is" thinks that this strike is more important than my family - then you need to wake up! NOTHING is more important than them. NOTHING.

    /End Rant
    Gatt I understand where you are coming from.

    The positive thing is that you are in a union and 'supporting' others through that.

    Now I am being devils advocate here:

    You say you have important things in your life, your family first and foremost. Of course you have to think of them and provide for them.

    BUT

    If you accept a pay cut in relative terms, year after year, and lets remember that the government are pushing for a three year 2.45% pay deal, you will effectively reduce your families standard of living over the next few years.

    As for pay increases pushing up inflation!!

    Well since I have had a below payrise for the last three or more years that has really worked hasn't it. I can't see inflation getting any lower and to be honest pay rises are not the primary factor in inflation figures.

    We all have choices to make and if you are happy with your pay then take no action. If you are not happy you have two choices, get another job or take industrial action for decent terms and conditions. Simple really.

    The other unions that are not striking are perhaps not the right union for you. I know quite a few ATL union members that have moved over to Unison as ATL will support lecturers and teachers to the hilt but have not come up with support this time for teaching assistants etc.

    Minorities majorites. So now we are saying that you should not respect what minorities have to say?

    Just becuase a minority have voted does not mean that they are less worthy, in fact that minority may be so low paid that they have nothing to lose? A couple of days pay could be so low that they would not miss it. You could also say that the low turn out/apathy means that many don't mind if Unison go out on strike or not. If the majority had strong views they would have all voted.

    Finally, we all have choices and opinions, and I repect those individual choices and opinions.

    regards

    Alex

  5. #35
    cookie_monster's Avatar
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    If you accept a pay cut in relative terms, year after year, and lets remember that the government are pushing for a three year 2.45% pay deal, you will effectively reduce your families standard of living over the next few years.
    I can't see inflation getting any lower and to be honest pay rises are not the primary factor in inflation figures.
    A booming economy has been responsible for inflation (untill the recent short term energy rise) a long downturn like the one looming will bring inflation down. In that situation the government will see a year on year decrease in tax revenue due to a shrinking economy. They will find it very hard to find these payrises. I still say take the 2.4% and see next year.
    Last edited by cookie_monster; 16th July 2008 at 12:09 PM.

  6. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by cookie_monster View Post
    They will find it very hard to find these payrises. I still say take the 2.4% and see next year.
    Yes but they are fixing the pay deal at 2.4% for the next 3 years! That's why it's important to take action now as we will have no comeback next year.

  7. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by alexknight View Post
    Gatt I understand where you are coming from.

    The other unions that are not striking are perhaps not the right union for you. I know quite a few ATL union members that have moved over to Unison as ATL will support lecturers and teachers to the hilt but have not come up with support this time for teaching assistants etc.
    Myself and another member of staff who is in ATL were put in similar positions of being severely overworked (we are talking doing 70-80 hours per week no with no overtime payment). I managed to get through it unscathed with the support of Unison and also received the extra support I needed from SLT and the council. He got no support from ATL and is now on 2 payscales lower than he was. He has since left ATL and joined Unison
    Last edited by teejay; 16th July 2008 at 05:07 PM.

  8. #38
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    We can always return to the negotiating table if it gets silly but a period of deflation and falling tax revenue is predicted. The government are being sensible for once i'm afraid.
    Last edited by cookie_monster; 16th July 2008 at 05:52 PM.

  9. #39

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    From what I understand, if this pay deal is accepted it is fixed for three years with virtually no option to negotiate. I understand the problem the government have, but in situations like this a sensible government would halt some of their crackpot schemes such as ID cards which would save billions per year, which could then be spent on helping those on the lowest salaries.
    I have a couple of friends who work in debt councelling charities and the problems they are now seeing from people on low wages really is horrible. These are people who have tried really hard, not gone mad spending stupidly but are now in situations where they are really struggling to put food on the table and pay their rent, bills etc.
    I'm not supporting the strike for my benefit as what I get paid is a livable wage, but it's the one who are really trying on 6 per hour jobs who I'm fighting for.

  10. #40
    cookie_monster's Avatar
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    While i appreciate what you're saying these salary levels are always going to be an issue i used to earn below the first minimum wage when it was bought in, i received a payrise when it came in but this was eaten by inflation, when the next rise came along the same thing happened. I still have friends on minimum wage and they say the same, as soon as spending power increases for the masses so do prices.
    This is why i'm still a fan of a lower rate of tax for the bottom rung earners but the current conservative government got rid of it.

  11. #41

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    Local Govt employees have accepted below inflation pay rises for the last 5 years. Meanwhile the Govt has awarded greater pay rises for civil servants,civilian support staff in the police, fire and ambulance services and even NHS workers. This means a cleaner working elsewhere for the Govt gets paid more than a cleaner working for the local council. Why is that? Are they less worthy?

    All Unison wants is equality for its members with other government employees. A 6% increase will go some way towards delivering that equality.

    As for the poor turnout at the ballot, we live in a democracy, a society were people are neither compelled or threatened with violence to vote. We elect MPs and local councillors with equally poor turn out and nobody refuses to recognise the validity of those ballots. If you don't vote you have to accept your destiny is in the hands of others.

  12. Thanks to broc from:

    leco (16th July 2008)

  13. #42
    cookie_monster's Avatar
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    As a citizen i can always vote and so can everyone else so they only have themselves to blame, as a non union member i have no say so it's a bit annoying that a low member turnout vote has this result. Now i'm still waiting for my payrise

  14. #43
    leco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cookie_monster View Post
    Now I'm still waiting for my pay rise
    As are we all. The negotiations for this pay award started well before it was due to be paid. If the Local Government Employers had wanted to they could have agreed and paid it on time. Please try not to blame Unison for the shortcomings of others.

  15. #44
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    I'm blaming them for not taking no for an answer taking the offer and coming up with a better plan next year.

    All Unison wants is equality for its members with other government employees
    One problem here is the way that local councils are funded.

  16. #45
    leco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cookie_monster View Post
    I'm blaming them for not taking no for an answer taking the offer and coming up with a better plan next year.
    Already stated - this pay offer is fixed for the next three years, so coming up with a better plan next year is not an option.

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