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General Chat Thread, The reference problem in General; Some times I get put off applying for jobs some times when they ask for references. I can understand why ...
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    The reference problem

    Some times I get put off applying for jobs some times when they ask for references. I can understand why the people ask for them and I agree with that in most ways. But I'm never really sure who to ask for references and I feel uncomfortable putting peoples names some times. For one reason is you need to ask the person so in effect you have to explain that your looking for another job and that could make things complicated. And another thing some of the people who are high up in the company they are so busy that they don't even answer their phone so it would be hard for them to be contacted for a reference and they have better things to do than talk about references. Also I like to be more discreet about going to interviews for various reasons I don't like the whole work place to know that I'm looking for jobs its a private kind of thing. And another thing is that if I get an interview its a competitive world out there and then if they don't select me for the job the people who I ask to give references would started to get a bit annoyed if I keep going for interviews and they keep getting asked for references so how do I get around this issue.

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    If you are applying for a job in education from a current education role then one of your referees must be your headteacher. It is standard practice and is expected. It is just the way education recruitment works.

    Regardless, you should always quote your current employer/employer's HR manager as a referee as the new employer will expect to to be able to check up that you have been turning up for work and doing the job you claim.

    Your second reference can be more of a problem. Ideally this should be someone you know professionally ... and you should always ask before you use them. Warning your employer is a good idea too, but not always possible.

    If applying outside education the referees will most likely only be called after interview. For safeguarding reasons, in education referees are called before interview which can be problematic. But if two schools are involved, both will be used to the idea and not be worried about repeat requests.

    Don't let your fear of asking people to be a referee put you off applying for jobs. Unless you have truly blotted your copy book, few will refuse or hold it against you.

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    Many application forms (including ours) have a question "can we approach this referee before interview" - if you answer "no" to that then the referee won't be approached unless you're offered the job. If you're applying via letter/CV then it's perfectly reasonable to put "do not approach this referee before interview" next to the name

    As @elsiegee40 has said, one referee needs to be your current or most recent employer - it would be very worrying if you don't list that person (an exception would be if you worked for an organisation which has closed down but you do need to make that clear)

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    Under Safer Recruitment though references in the vast majority (if not all) cases have to be collected before interview.

    The way SR is written practically puts the candidate under a cloud if they do not provide references before interview.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trapper View Post
    Under Safer Recruitment though references in the vast majority (if not all) cases have to be collected before interview.

    The way SR is written practically puts the candidate under a cloud if they do not provide references before interview.
    This is correct and potentially a difficult one for people who work outside education who want to join the sector. Those already working in schools should not be worrying about references being called early by another school... it is normal and it is what happens in every school for every member of staff.

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    Few managers and employers are so foolish as to get upset when their staff apply for other jobs. One Head I know had a standard reply when asked why so many teachers were leaving, or why so many were new. "Well, Mrs Parent, I have a choice. I can appoint good staff, in which case they will leave for promotion; or I can appoint poor staff, who won't be able to leave. Which would you advise me to do?"

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    Jon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ketlane View Post
    Few managers and employers are so foolish as to get upset when their staff apply for other jobs. One Head I know had a standard reply when asked why so many teachers were leaving, or why so many were new. "Well, Mrs Parent, I have a choice. I can appoint good staff, in which case they will leave for promotion; or I can appoint poor staff, who won't be able to leave. Which would you advise me to do?"
    I would want to know why the school wasn't capable of retaining the good staff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jon View Post
    I would want to know why the school wasn't capable of retaining the good staff.
    If there is no promotion pathway - consider a Science teacher, wants HoD as next step, incumbent HoD unlikely to move for whatever reason.....

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