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General Chat Thread, Woolwich Attack in General; Originally Posted by tmcd35 So COBRA convenes and asks these questions every time there is a random murder? A violent ...
  1. #31

    localzuk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tmcd35 View Post
    So COBRA convenes and asks these questions every time there is a random murder?
    A violent attack by apparent religious extremists in a very public place? Yeah, they would convene for that.

  2. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by tmcd35 View Post
    Fallout? Why? So every time there's a random murder on the street the first thing the BBC, Sky News, Daily Mail (actually they probably would) do is phone downing street and say "have you convened COBRA yet?". I don't buy it. This is a knee jerk reaction to an unfortunate event that sends all the wrong messages to the country in my book.
    The attackers may well be random nutters just claiming that their motivation was Islam, but surely the fact that they made such a claim turns it into something that warrants further investigation? If they'd been ranting about doing it in the name of Mother Gaia, then Cameron would probably still be enjoying the fine wines of France.

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    Quote Originally Posted by witch View Post
    It appalls me that the police could describe someone who is other than chalk white as "of muslim appearance" unless they were wearing a burkha or a sign. Definitely institutional racism.
    Possibly described as of muslim appearance in that the comments they made made them appear to be muslim? (use of Allah in some of the witness reports)

  4. #34

    tmcd35's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    A violent attack by [B]apparent religious extremists[/B] in a very public place? Yeah, they would convene for that.
    That's the bit that gets me. I think this steams from one of them shouting the islamic for "god is great". I fear this is going to be a couple of nut jobs upset with the government because their benefit was stopped, or some such. When do we loose sight of the line between individual religious nutters and terrorist sleeper cells? Have we really become that paranoid as a society?

    Like I say, I think the wrong messages are being sent by both the media and government.

  5. #35

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    Eyewitness Describes Moment He Witnessed Attack In Woolwich

    This includes some detail I had not heard before [Note: Some content might cause upset]


  6. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by tmcd35 View Post
    That's the bit that gets me. I think this steams from one of them shouting the islamic for "god is great". I fear this is going to be a couple of nut jobs upset with the government because their benefit was stopped, or some such. When do we loose sight of the line between individual religious nutters and terrorist sleeper cells? Have we really become that paranoid as a society?

    Like I say, I think the wrong messages are being sent by both the media and government.
    To be honest, which would you prefer, that COBRA didn't convene based on the information that has been provided through the media (there's probably a whole lot more information that we don't know about) and there be possible further attacks from groups (if linked) or that COBRA did convene, did some work (I don't think they get paid overtime for that) and ensure that the police/security services are doing there jobs?

    At present we don't know whether there are individual nutters, sleeper cells, non-religious home grown terrorists using religion as a shield for their real identity and agenda or someone testing the response to a suspected attack on a member of the armed forces, or whatever else it may have been.

  7. #37

    tmcd35's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Willott View Post
    To be honest, which would you prefer, that COBRA didn't convene based on the information that has been provided through the media (there's probably a whole lot more information that we don't know about) and there be possible further attacks from groups (if linked) or that COBRA did convene, did some work (I don't think they get paid overtime for that) and ensure that the police/security services are doing there jobs?)
    Honestly? - Probably that they did convene but didn't make such a song and dance all over the media about it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tmcd35 View Post
    Honestly? - Probably that they did convene but didn't make such a song and dance all over the media about it.
    24/7 news you have to report something whether its new or not

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    Quote Originally Posted by witch View Post
    * @DeltaBravo Surely it is terrible for this to be done to ANYONE?
    @witch Of course it is a terrible thing to happen to anyone, I was just relating to this instant.

  10. #40


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    Quote Originally Posted by witch View Post
    I wonder what the woman standing in front of the guy ranting, holding a cleaver and with blood dripping off his hands, was thinking
    Here is her account...

    www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/may/22/woolwich-first-person-account

  11. #41
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    I watched Newsnight last night and I think it explained why COBRA was involved - 1) They expected these sorts of attacks from extremists during the Olympics 2) Sources telling journalists that one of the suspects had previously tried to join up with terrorist organisations.

    If the suspects did wait for armed Police, and then rushed them, I believe that they wanted martyrdom.

    * Edited Link: it was for Tuesday's episode and last night's isn't available at the moment
    Last edited by 36Degrees; 23rd May 2013 at 11:26 AM.

  12. #42

    tmcd35's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 36Degrees View Post
    I watched Newsnight last night and I think it explained why COBRA was involved - 1) They expected these sorts of attacks from extremists during the Olympics 2) Sources telling journalists that one of the suspects had previously tried to join up with terrorist organisations.

    If the suspects did wait for armed Police, and then rushed them, I believe that they wanted martyrdom.
    Something just feels wrong about that. I don't what, or why, so maybe I'm not explaining it right? But even more so after reading the fascinating (and more news worthy) link in @Arthur's post, I've got this gut feeling that this doesn't fit right with the "terrorists hiding behind every bush" scenario. Maybe I'm wrong, who knows?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Arthur View Post
    It would be nice if people remembered this incident, not because of the horrific lunacy, but because an ordinary woman acting to help others without a thought for her personal safety is an extraordinary example of compassion and humanity. Ingrid Loyau-Kennett, I salute you.

  14. 4 Thanks to pcstru:

    ButterflyMoon (23rd May 2013), hardtailstar (23rd May 2013), Willott (23rd May 2013), witch (23rd May 2013)

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    Doesn't matter why they did it, THEY DID IT. Unfortunatley the only punishment they can recieve is "life" imprisonment, which is never for life. Bring back Capitol punishment - Life for a life.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tmcd35 View Post
    after reading the fascinating (and more news worthy) link in @Arthur's post, I've got this gut feeling that this doesn't fit right with the "terrorists hiding behind every bush" scenario.
    Perhaps - the interviewees were ex-Home Secratary John Reid and someone else who was heavily involved in UK security strategies from 2000 to 2011 (sorry I can't be more specific, last night's Newsnight isn't on iPlayer as I thought). I don't believe there are "terrorists hiding behind every bush" either and I know the media love to sensationalise, invent facts, print unverified speculation, etc. but I hope that the decision to use COBRA was based on intelligence and not just a knee-jerk reaction.

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