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Gaming Thread, Next generation consoles. What to expect in Fun Stuff; Originally Posted by localzuk I don't think the DVD drive is that much of an issue with the advent of ...
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    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    I don't think the DVD drive is that much of an issue with the advent of downloadable content packs. Downloading a gig of data is not a massive issue for most people any more.
    1gb isnt. 25gb for one game is.

    How many disks was Final Fantasy 13 with non 1080p video? No Final Fantasy 13 verses or 14, the agency. Rockstar had to limit GTA. A new limitation that'll have an impact.
    Last edited by Theblacksheep; 23rd November 2010 at 10:04 AM.

  2. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by Theblacksheep View Post
    1gb isnt. 25 for one game is.
    But considering the RAM available on the machine, and the graphics capabilities, 25GB of data for an Xbox 360 is highly unlikely.

    Not to mention, the point of downloadable content is that you do it in bits. You download a pack of levels at a time etc...

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    tmcd35's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theblacksheep View Post
    1gb isnt. 25 for one game is.
    But how many games truly need 25gb in one hit? I reckon most games are in the 100-500mb marker with graphics and sound for the current level/course/song/race track/whatever taking only a gig or two on top of that. If you download parts of a game at a time, as you need them a 25gig game might not be all that ownerous download. Espeacily if a lot of the downloading is happening in the background while you're playing the current level. Add in the use of Bit-Torrent style downloading (multiple seeds) and you have the basics of something that would would work well with todays technology. So in 5 years time once Virgin have rolled out 100mb every where and 21C broadband as got 40+Gb (nearly) everywhere else...

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    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    But considering the RAM available on the machine, and the graphics capabilities.
    Same ram as PS3, simelar graphics capabilities.


    MGS4 was 25gb.
    GT5 is 20gb.
    FF13 was 33gb, was it reduced to 3 disks or 4 with only 720 video?

    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    25GB of data for an Xbox 360 is highly unlikely.
    Thats kinda my point. Games companies are now limiting their games because of the xbox dvd drive.


    Quote Originally Posted by tmcd35 View Post
    But how many games truly need 25gb in one hit? I reckon most games are in the 100-500mb marker with graphics and sound for the current level/course/song/race track/whatever taking only a gig or two on top of that. If you download parts of a game at a time, as you need them a 25gig game might not be all that ownerous download....
    Not a probem in 5+ years. 25 GB games are out now.
    Last edited by Theblacksheep; 23rd November 2010 at 10:13 AM.

  5. #35


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    Quote Originally Posted by tmcd35 View Post
    really? 5 years is a long time in IT. I'd be shocked if SSD technology doesn't improve, become better, faster, cheaper and a lot more common place in 4 years. Economics of scale and all that.
    I was thinking more like 3 years (at least for Microsoft's next console) since we are almost in 2011. The Xbox 360 will be nine years old by that time and games will look very dated in comparison to the latest PC games (they already do now). Releasing their next console alongside Kinect v2.0 would be a great way to make gamers part with even more money.

    Regarding SSDs; assuming they reach £1 per GB by June 2011, I reckon we will see affordable 1TB SSDs mid to late 2014. If my maths are correct, a 1TB SSD should cost around £300 which is still too pricey to include as standard in a console. I could see them using a 300GB/320GB SSD perhaps, but not a 1TB SSD (Moore's Law does have limits). Microsoft in particular also loves to gouge customers on overpriced accessories (until quite recently they were charging over £100 for a 120GB HDD!) so I see no reason why they would be that generous. I really hope Microsoft and Nintendo follow Sony's lead and allow you to fit your own drives - you can use whatever HDD/SSD you want then.

    I'm not so sure. Again 5 years being an eternity in IT and all that. If they do have optical drives then they'd be the last generation that do, certainly be cheap enough to implement by then.
    I agree that the next generation of consoles will be the last generation to use optical discs. Broadband speeds and bandwidth caps need to increase first before we can completely eliminate discs however. Also, given the resistance from retailers like Game/GameStation over Steam, they are going to do everything they can to prevent console manufacturers from going the download-only route. If most people buy or rent their music, movies and games online there will be nothing left for them to sell (other than perhaps T-shirts).

    Quote Originally Posted by tmcd35 View Post
    If you look at the existing online PS3 and XBox stores and look at services like Steam then downloading games is already a very real reality.
    While downloading games is definitely a reality today - I currently have almost 250GBs worth of games in my Steam folder, I don't see the average person wanting to download the majority of their games. Also, are parents going to let thier sons and daughters loose with thier credit cards to buy games online or waste money on points which can't be used for anything else?

    Quote Originally Posted by tmcd35 View Post
    Also we are already seeing the introduction of services such as OnLive streaming games so I think, even if they do still have blu-ray, this will be the major push of the next gen.
    I really like the idea of OnLive, but there are currently too many issues with it (namely latency, bandwidth, graphics quality, inconsistent framerates, limited selection of games, no way to use mods etc.). There is no doubt this will improve over time, but it's not really a viable option at the moment with the average speed of broadband being around 3-4Mbps and FPSs requiring split-second accuracy. There's also the fact that you lose the games you "buy" if you stop using the service.

    Quote Originally Posted by tmcd35 View Post
    I'm surprised you didn't call me out on the iOS9 on PS4 - now I thought that was far fetched
    Well, Apple does have enough money to buy Sony, so it's not too far fetched.

  6. #36
    kevbaz's Avatar
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    So itll be the iStation? (im patenting that name right now! haha) massive apple logo on it and a all in one entertainment system (nothing will be just a console anymore) and phone features such as texts and voip via a headset/controller

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    In some ways Sony could be a good purchase for Apple. In others it seems a bad fit. I think if they bought Sony it'd be for some IP's and they'd be splitting and reselling lots of the company.

    The whole music industry and PS4 would be right up Apple street. Also movie distrubution, could give AppleTV a major boost. But movie making, general electronics - TV's, blu ray players, etc. Sony is one mighty big beast - Apple, although cash rich, is not such a big beast. Apple are three products - iTunes, iPhone, iMac - everything else revolves around that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tmcd35 View Post
    In some ways Sony could be a good purchase for Apple.
    About as much chance as Apple buying MS.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Theblacksheep View Post
    Same ram as PS3, simelar graphics capabilities.

    MGS4 was 25gb.
    GT5 is 20gb.
    FF13 was 33gb, was it reduced to 3 disks or 4 with only 720 video?

    Thats kinda my point. Games companies are now limiting their games because of the xbox dvd drive.

    Not a probem in 5+ years. 25 GB games are out now.
    All games are limited by the platform they run on...

    But you missed the main points made - 25GB is a lot in one go, sure, but in 1GB chunks, as you play? Not much really.

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    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    25GB is a lot in one go, sure, but in 1GB chunks, as you play? Not much really.
    If it was easy they'd be doing it now. Like dynamic loading content from disk. "Please wait while loading level 2... 3gb to go"...

    You are also assuming everyone has an internet connection, most consoles dont actually go online.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Theblacksheep View Post
    You are also assuming everyone has an internet connection, most consoles dont actually go online.
    We are also guessing at how the world may change over the next four or five years. Looking back at how much as changed in the past 4 or 5 years, does it really seem that far fetched?

    Truth is no one will know until they big three start seriously announcing their plans (a couple of years away - at least). I for one would be surprised given recent advances in online gaming if there isn't a huge push in that direction - even if it is not the sole games media for the device.

  12. #42

    localzuk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theblacksheep View Post
    If it was easy they'd be doing it now. Like dynamic loading content from disk. "Please wait while loading level 2... 3gb to go"...

    You are also assuming everyone has an internet connection, most consoles dont actually go online.
    They *do* do it now. DLC is one of the biggest markets in gaming now, as it allows people to get new games without leaving their sofa. I've not bought a game dvd for a few years! Downloading can be done in the background, whilst playing - there's no need for 'loading'.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Theblacksheep View Post
    You are also assuming everyone has an internet connection, most consoles dont actually go online.
    Exactly. 23% of all US households don't even have Internet access so it's probably a bit too early to release an Internet only console.

    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    They *do* do it now. DLC is one of the biggest markets in gaming now, as it allows people to get new games without leaving their sofa.
    Unlike on the PC, you can't download games like Call of Duty: Black Ops on consoles can you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Arthur View Post
    Exactly. 23% of all US households don't even have Internet access so it's probably a bit too early to release an Internet only console.
    And what percentage don't own a console? You're forgetting that those who don't have the internet are usually the same group that are either a) aged b) poor and can't afford it or c) technophobes.

    So, the likelihood is - if you have a console, you'll have the net.

    Unlike on the PC, you can't download games like Call of Duty: Black Ops on consoles can you?
    That is simply a decision by the studios. There's no technical reason not.

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    I have both xbox and ps3 and use the xbox more. downloads are much faster and don't need installing at the end and games like gta have always needed to load the next section on ps3 sometimes with a longish wait, the xbox loads the other level/area while playing and you don't have to stop.



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