@Pottsey I can see your point but you are missing one vital fact - by the time mobile devices have caught up with current gen consoles in terms of graphics and memory capability, dedicated consoles will be generations ahead.
The simple fact is, tech takes time to be scaled down. The GPU in a smartphone today is just as good as it was in a PC 10 years ago, but nowhere near a current gen gaming PC. Unless there is some radical discovery in the way chips are manufactured (which I'm not denying there could be), it will always be the case that portable devices are a couple of generations behind.
This is why I can't see the hardcore gaming community moving away from a dedicated device - to many of them, games being at the bleeding edge of hardware technology is important, it's part of the fun to see just how far games can push graphics, detail and story depth, and this always ends up coming to the point where the hardware needs improving, hence next gen consoles.
The gen after if there is one for consoles the gap will be even shorter. If you look at the R&D company’s we are already seeing the start of advance technology like Ray tracing being developed for mobiles. Console are not expected to have for over 10years in the generation after next. This could lead to crazy situation when in 5 to 6 years current console will be half way though there life span with mobiles looking far better graphically.
I think I might be derailing this thread, didn’t mean to. One thing I do agree on is always on connection is bad. My experience with that has been nothing but bad.
“The GPU in a smartphone today is just as good as it was in a PC 10 years ago, but nowhere near a current gen gaming PC.”
I think you might need to take a look at mobile tech. Mobiles over took 10 year old PC’s years ago. Last gen chips where only a tiny bit behind the Xbox360. The 2013 mobile chips I believe are due to be x3 faster than the Xbox360 in power and are only a few years behind PC’s. Graphics Company’s R&D no longer scale down larger chips to mobile level but develop from mobile level upwards. The rate of mobile technology advance has been amazing recently.
Last edited by Pottsey; 8th February 2013 at 10:58 AM.
I think the main thing to bear in mind is that 6 years ago there were no smartphones as we now know them, not all-glass touchscreen beauties as begat by the iPhone. So guessing what will happen in another 6 years is entirely futile. The singularity, it approaches.
I've a feeling you've been reading the same PowerVR stories I have. Truth be told Real Time Ray Tracing is the golden goose of GPU design. Still supposed to be 10 years off, even for mobile. I'm sure if it was worth while and came about sooner Sony and MS would license the tech from PowerVR for there next next gen's. I've read reports recently they suggest that current gen polygon shifters are so good that there's little to no benefit in real time ray tracing.If you look at the R&D companyís we are already seeing the start of advance technology like Ray tracing being developed for mobiles. Console are not expected to have for over 10years in the generation after next.
Some thread's are meant to be derailed EduGeeks more interesting for the topical discussions we get from them!I think I might be derailing this thread, didnít mean to.
Rogue chips that have just started showing look to be around 210Gflops and 13Gpixels/sec for the low end 2 cluster version. There is a 4 cluster version which I assume has twice the power. On top of that PowerVR mobile chips use a tiled based deferred rendering architecture so they effectively do x3 the work for each bit of raw speed compared to desktop cards. That makes a direct comparison a little tricky as a 100gflops PowerVR chip can in theory perform at the same level as say a 300gflops NVidia chip roughly speaking as its more complicated than that. A better example is the Kyro 2 was a tiled based deferred rendering with the raw specs far lower than a Geforce 2 MX yet it could compete against it.
If the raw specs of 210 Gflops turn out to be true we could be talking around 500gflops worth of desktop type GPU power in mobiles this year, enough power for Skyrim, GTA5, Call of Duty . Next gen consoles will win out at first but they will find in a short time mobile GPU's will have overtaken them. Either consoles makers need to half the lifespan for next gen consoles or they will fall behind. Or come up with some other idea.
One of the benefits of Ray Tracing is lowering production costs while giving better lights and shadows. You no longer need artists to spend time messing around with faking lights and placing shadow maps as it is all done for you. Personally I see the RTU chips merging into the GPU with a hybrid of Ray Tracing and GPU solution being the way forward.
Samsung Exynos 5 Dual (Nexus 10): 12.8 GigaBytes/s (72.488 GFLOPS)
nVidia GeForce GTX 680: 192.3 GigaBytes/s (3,090.4 GFLOPS)
nVidia GeForce GTX Titan: ~250 GigaBytes/s
Shedding some realistic light on Imagination’s real-time ray tracing card | Ars Technica
The first highlighted comment makes for some interesting reading, talking about real time ray tracing being a decelerator on performance for most games and suggesting incremental improvements in current GPU tech taking up the slack for what real time ray tracing requirements we might have.
http://ts2.mm.bing.net/th?id=H.49866...73025&pid=15.1 and renders each tile one at a time.
Another benefit is 99% of overdraw is remove. Say there is a wall, everything behind the wall is removed, and then the screen is rendered. This can vastly reducing memory needed, bandwidth needed and improving speed.
This picture explains it a bit better than me. Conventional Nvidia and ATI cards render almost everything, PowerVR only render visible surfaces.
A conventional Nvidia and ATI would require 43 Mpixiles to render that screen. PowerVR require 14.4 Mpixiles to render that screen which is why I say the specs can be x3 lower but the performance the same. Hopefully this explains how mobiles are closing the gap with desktop GPU's.
This diffrence in architecture’s makes it a little tricky to compare raw mobile GPU specs to raw Desktop GPU specs. As a guideline I times all Tiled based deferred rendering architecture’s specs by 3 to compare to Nvidia and ATI architecture’s. But it really depends on the scene being rendered. A racing screen in open fields or some sort of Airplane scene is going have few hidden objects to remove while a city scene is going have a massive amount of surfaces to remove.
Last edited by Pottsey; 8th February 2013 at 05:21 PM.
As for deadspace, I need the screaming of undead amped in my 1200W surround system, on a big screen, in the dark, nothing else cuts it.
GPU wise, sure they may be catching up to the 6 year old system that is about to be replaced but try current gen.
Oh and iPhoney fanboys, I have had a smartphone since 2003, iPoo was not the start, my WM2003 phone had features not even thought of till 2008-10. Steve Jobs did not invent everything.
Last edited by SYNACK; 8th February 2013 at 05:45 PM.
Here is my argument, why would the companies (sony or microsoft) get themselves OUT of the market by doing this?
On the PC it is effective because of the fact that it is a one off serial code and people have grown used to this, but such a thing is still a big bitchfest on consoles. Infact when I made the switch, I was surprised that they weren't already implimenting some form of serial key, then EA started doing it, and then next thing you know, console fanboys are going mental because they can no longer get 2nd hand EA games.
What I dont understand, is why does it bother people, 2nd hand games are great, but buying a serial for £10 will hardly break the bank, and if you buy the 2nd hand game quite new, you're better off buying the game new.
Also I doubt you or I won't be able to get or generate these codes so we have no choice but to sell them on to companies to get the profit and they will have even more of an excuse to pay a pittance. Or if the system allows people to generate their own when you Ebay a game and suddenly you have to provide aftercare support when teh person who bought hasn't a clue what to do. What about hand me down games? I've just given a whole stack of games to my Nephew who got an Xbox for Christmas, there is no way I could do that if I or his mum have to try and buy a load of replay codes.
I guess what it comes down to is that there are far too many unknowns based on this tiny rumour so for now we just have to wait and see.
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