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Educational Software Thread, Educational Recources and ELC's in Technical; I've just discovered that we've just paid nearly two and a half grand in ELC's for some powerpoint presentations :!: ...
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    Educational Recources and ELC's

    I've just discovered that we've just paid nearly two and a half grand in ELC's for some powerpoint presentations :!: :!:

    I know the ELC thing was setup with good intent. It seems to me like the system is being rinsed by ex-teachers who don't have a clue about programming, is creating unnecessary lock-in and creating an atmosphere of 'won't share' in the educational community. /rant

    This does seem such a scam, why is it that teachers can't actually produce these resources for themselves and put them on their websites for their students and other schools to benefit?
    Does anyone here (other than us, who share advice/resources regularly) know teachers who actually produce and share resources, can someone point me to some sites that do this.

    thanks

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    webman's Avatar
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    Re: Educational Recources and ELC's

    Would laziness and greediness come into it at some point?

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    Re: Educational Recources and ELC's

    I suspect so, but surely there must be some teachers in the country with a philosophy of sharing their knowledge - where are you !

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    Re: Educational Recources and ELC's

    <devils advocate>
    Bearing in mind the time it would take some of my users to produce somethin g like they can buy, it may be cheaper in terms of wasted man-hours
    </devils advocate>

    Having said that, the most my lot have spent on "prepared work" is <£50, I too would be in an arse-kicking mood if someone thought it was ok to spend £2K on powerpoint slides, you can get a Macromedia Studio 8 site license for that kind of money (also through elc).

    elcs are ring-fenced beyond belief (though it has got better this year).

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    Re: Educational Recources and ELC's

    Code:
    elcs are ring-fenced beyond belief (though it has got better this year).
    If only that was true, try calling an ELC supplier such as Ramesys and tell them your willing to buy lots of *anything* with ELC's, as long as they throw in some other, non-elc software - Its a scam I tell you, the money would be better spent encouraging teachers to produce and share their work.

    Bearing in mind the time it would take some of my users to produce somethin g like they can buy, it may be cheaper in terms of wasted man-hours
    Surely the teachers are required to produce lesson plans and resources as part of their jobs - its not a great leap forward to publish it as web-content. Go to most Uni websites and you'll find all manner of literature and course material, I don't see why schools have such a different culture.
    IMO teachers (here) seem to be using ICT for the sake of it rather than to produce any beneficial resources.

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    Re: Educational Recources and ELC's

    If only that was true, try calling an ELC supplier such as Ramesys and tell them your willing to buy lots of *anything* with ELC's, as long as they throw in some other, non-elc software
    I don't handle ELC purchases myself, but "ring-fenced" is the line I'm getting from head of ict. If he's being too weak when bargaining I may have to take over. hmmm,

    IMO teachers (here) seem to be using ICT for the sake of it rather than to produce any beneficial resources.
    I'll swap ten of your teachers for ten of mine...... deal? Too many of mine are still in the "it's too complicated to use" / laptop = "powerpoint machine" (actual term used) stage.

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    webman's Avatar
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    Re: Educational Recources and ELC's

    Quote Originally Posted by CyberNerd
    Surely the teachers are required to produce lesson plans and resources as part of their jobs
    They jsut download them off the net...

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    Re: Educational Recources and ELC's

    As I understand it, any materials to be purchased with elcs and any manufacturer has to be vetted and approved. So presumably someone has vetted and approved these ppoint files and the makers/suppliers?

    It is my firm belief that if any teacher uses their own time, skills, ideas and resources to produce educational resources, then they have a right to sell them if they so wish and, equally, a right to give them away free if they so wish. What is often less acceptable is that a school or local authority has a claim to such resources.

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    Re: Educational Recources and ELC's

    As I understand it, any materials to be purchased with elcs and any manufacturer has to be vetted and approved. So presumably someone has vetted and approved these ppoint files and the makers/suppliers?
    Indeed, I have issues with the quality and price of some of this 'software'

    It is my firm belief that if any teacher uses their own time, skills, ideas and resources to produce educational resources, then they have a right to sell them if they so wish and, equally, a right to give them away free if they so wish. What is often less acceptable is that a school or local authority has a claim to such resources.
    I don't see a problem with teachers using their own time to do whatever they please.
    I do see a problem if resources are produced during the course of someones employment that are to be used in an institution and are produced using by staff using equipment owned by the institution - in this case the institution should have claim to such resourses.

    and is there anything to stop a technician writing an application (in their own time, of course) licensing it under restrictive conditions then imbedding it into the school? - after time she could then ransom the school to their terms. My belief is that reourses produced for schools (by staff) should be freely and publicaly available.
    Sadly there seems to be a culture that prohibits this.

    since none of the staff have copyrighted their own materials produced at this school, whats to stop someone else from publishing them?
    [/RMS]

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    Re: Educational Recources and ELC's

    Quote Originally Posted by deerwood
    As I understand it, any materials to be purchased with elcs and any manufacturer has to be vetted and approved. So presumably someone has vetted and approved these ppoint files and the makers/suppliers?
    God knows how the vetting procedure is done, because loads of ELC approved software is pure cack! Conversely loads of good useful stuff is not approved. It seems to me that the approved list is pretty arbitrary.

    An example of the madness - a year or two ago I was asked to buy graphics software. Adobe Photoshop, £106/licence, approved - Corel Graphics Suite, £16/licence, not approved. We bought Corel - cough!!

    RoyG

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    Re: Educational Recources and ELC's

    Don't get me started, I will choke on the rage and then have a coronary!! ELC's are one of those things that are great on paper but no one thinks about it. Our network is full of software now thanks to them, but most of it is hardly used. Staff hear of free money and order everything under the sun! The best scam I have seen is make paper resources into PDF's and then charge £200 for them as they are electronic now. But then supply the paper based resource as well which is what the staff actually want!!!!

    We now try and get whole school resources, either online stuff like Guardian Unlimited, or software that will be cross curricular, to try and use them all up as quickly as possible!

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    Re: Educational Recources and ELC's

    Quote Originally Posted by CyberNerd
    I've just discovered that we've just paid nearly two and a half grand in ELC's for some powerpoint presentations :!: :!:
    Uhm, err.. we've spent a lot more than that on Powerpoints with the magical eLC beans. ops:

    Not proud of it, but as the budget holder eLCs put me in a difficult position: I have a professional responsibility to get as much as I can for the school with the funding available (value doesn't come into it as we've tried hard and never managed to spend the lot), yet on the other hand I have a moral responsibility not to waste taxpayers money on software which looks like it was made by a 7 year old in a couple of hours. The Gov't are tackling this problem now by turning off the eLC tap.

    Quote Originally Posted by CyberNerd
    I know the ELC thing was setup with good intent.
    You're know that for sure?! It was originally set up as a sweetener for publishers of educational content that were mewing about the BBC giving equally good educational materials away for free. See editor's note 5. Never mind the fact that some people had and are giving away free stuff without public / tv license funding. You will notice the bizarre timing: they eLCs are tailing off just as the BBC materials they were bothered about start to come online.

    Quote Originally Posted by CyberNerd
    This does seem such a scam, why is it that teachers can't actually produce these resources for themselves and put them on their websites for their students and other schools to benefit?
    Does anyone here (other than us, who share advice/resources regularly) know teachers who actually produce and share resources, can someone point me to some sites that do this.
    Some of them do, and if the government was interested in saving taxpayers money, they would promote:

    :arrow: :arrow: The Teacher Resource Exchange

    in every staffroom in the country. Do a strawpoll in yours - I bet less than 1 in 20 staff have heard of it.

    ](*,)

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    Re: Educational Recources and ELC's

    I forgot to mention my hatred of "software" which is really a couple of word docs, pdfs or powerpoints that some numpty's chucked together in 5 minutes that require an ANNUAL LICENCE FEE.

    ?!!?

    You want me to "subscribe" to a directory of static files?! Ack.

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    Re: Educational Recources and ELC's

    Down here in Dorset, the teachers are supposed to put stuff up onto the SWGfL website to share. I know that one of my schools uses it, but I don't think they actually put things for other people to see.
    Having said that - I set up passwords and everything for people ages ago, and got some training on how to use the site from Linda, Web Manager/VLE co-ordinator for Dorset LA, (lindylou on this site) but to my knowledge only a couple of TAs actually use it!!
    It is a good site but without the direction from the SMT, the teachers won't get to grips with it.
    I will pass on details of The Teacher Resource Exchange to them!

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    Re: Educational Recources and ELC's

    From another excellent Forum www.ukgovernors.net.uk I recently picked up information about the new BBC initiative www.bbc.co.uk/jam I have seen Yr 1 and Yr 3 students using it so far and they love it and it seems - so far, hassle free!

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