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East Midlands Broadband Consortium (EMBC) Thread, School domains - who do I talk to? in Regional Broadband Consortiums (RBC); unfortunately nominet insist that all school address contain the LA name so there is no way of getting around it. ...
  1. #16

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    unfortunately nominet insist that all school address contain the LA name so there is no way of getting around it.

    you could ask the question of why staff cant remember what the school is called and where it is located!

  2. #17

    EduTech's Avatar
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    Ah right, thats no problem answers my question cheers

    but yeah, wish we never had so many staff who cant remember a simple email address!!

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    GrumbleDook's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PiqueABoo View Post
    Once upon a time, which wasn't all that long ago, you didn't have "tags" or charges for any of this. Consequently it took me cumulative days of increasingly irritating faffing about with Nominet to get them to change the NS records for a co.uk domain, and of course to do that without sending me a bill.

    Despite the above comment about Nominet holding unassigned tags, no one, but no one, in that organisation appeared to have the capacity to cope with the idea that *.uk domains that preceded Nominet's existence would not have tag holders - I wasn't an ISP and they couldn't cope.

    I'm still a bit gob-smacked by this rather special UK arrangement that insists an ISP "holds" the "tag" rather than the organisation.
    hehehe ... I was a registrar at one point to deal with a similar problem. Don't know how or why and it quickly disappeared when the ISP I wanted to have the tags (when they existed) queried it. Between Network Solutions and Nominet there appeared to be a severe lack of clue.

  4. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by deanc View Post
    unfortunately nominet insist that all school address contain the LA name so there is no way of getting around it.

    you could ask the question of why staff cant remember what the school is called and where it is located!
    It contains a 'region' name ... not LA. LAs change (the introduction of some more recent Unitary Authorities is an example) but the pre-defined regions don't. They tend to be county in origin but with some exceptions.

    The other issues are that some schools actually applied for domains ages ago and were given a domain but when Nominet were given lists by LAs the domains were suggested by the LA ... so you could have 2 (or 3) different domains for the same school ... all because someone forgot about DCSF numbers (DFEE/DFES/etc) and using then to check for uniqueness. The other part is that some schools may be primary, junior, infant or nursery and will get schoolname, schoolname-inf, schoolnameinf or schoolinitials or other variations ... it is sometimes hard to dig out what the domain should be. Paperwork that Nominet sent out a few years ago may have been filed in that grey, rectangular thing ... or a change in ICT Co-ordinator / Bursar / Head means people have no idea where things are.

  5. #20
    User3204's Avatar
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    If you check with BT and a few other providers, they will do .org.uk for free usually, if you have an xDSL line with them. There's nothing to stop you setting up schoolname.org.uk ast well as schoolname.region.sch.uk.

  6. #21

    matt40k's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by User3204 View Post
    If you check with BT and a few other providers, they will do .org.uk for free usually, if you have an xDSL line with them. There's nothing to stop you setting up schoolname.org.uk ast well as schoolname.region.sch.uk.
    Personally is ruddy annoys the hell out of me. It costs about £5 for 2 yrs for a .uk (i.e. .org.uk or .co.uk) but these expire and must be re-registered etc.

    It's a pain in my arse when you go to email a school and they have not renew normally because they haven't paid (Previous IT tech got it on his CC or such). Also, what’s the point of the government (well basically the government) going all schools will have a schoolname.region.sch.uk then schools going against this? It's like wiring a house up and going, no I'm not going to make the blue neutral, I'm going to make it live!!

    Makes sending emails to school so much easier too, what the region, Suffolk, right so it's schoolname.suffolk.sch.uk, ok bit of choice in what the actual name is (i.e. could be cut down) then it's just a question of working out what there naming scheme is for user accounts (some I wish people would follow also).

    I don't see the point of having both .co.uk or whatever + the schoolname.region.sch.uk, if you have the .co.uk you don't really want to use it publicly but you know it will, then before you know it you'll be getting the same problem as ranted about above.

    Sorry for the rant it just one of little things that really get to me.

  7. #22

    GrumbleDook's Avatar
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    Schools make use of .org, .com, .co.uk or .org.uk due to branding and the fact that they may use the domain for things other than general stuff for the school. I don't really see anything wrong with this as long as it is a long term decision and not just some random idea that someone has had.

  8. #23

    john's Avatar
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    I hate the length of our domain it makes it so easy to get wrong on the phone, and doesn't at times fit in boxes on forms We will be making use of .org.uk in the near future I hope to reduce this problem.

    I just got my local primary a .co.uk domain to use instead of the LEA system one so they have more flexibility.

  9. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by GrumbleDook View Post
    The other issues are that some schools actually applied for domains ages ago and were given a domain but when Nominet were given lists by LAs the domains were suggested by the LA ... so you could have 2 (or 3) different domains for the same school ... all because someone forgot about DCSF numbers (DFEE/DFES/etc) and using then to check for uniqueness. The other part is that some schools may be primary, junior, infant or nursery and will get schoolname, schoolname-inf, schoolnameinf or schoolinitials or other variations ... it is sometimes hard to dig out what the domain should be. Paperwork that Nominet sent out a few years ago may have been filed in that grey, rectangular thing ... or a change in ICT Co-ordinator / Bursar / Head means people have no idea where things are.
    not forgetting schools that change name due to the town going frome three tier to two tier, must be more of an issue with a few northants schools becoming academys,although my understanding is that these will completely ignore the .sch.uk domain and do thier own thing

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    We were originally issued with sch-ool-name-tier.lea.sch.uk which was utterly unmemorable. The then new head had an ex-pupil set up a web site on schoolnametiers.co.uk which confused things even further. When I was given the chance I contacted Nominet to change our lea name to take out all the hypens and the tier (school.lea.sch.uk) and registered it to the school. Nominet couldn't have been more helpful, I needed a lot of hand holding at the time.

    Now the RBC hold the tag, host the web site (new one on new name) and I don't have to even think about it any more
    Last edited by leco; 25th April 2009 at 10:40 PM. Reason: slightly re-worded

  11. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by EduTech View Post
    A little bit off topic, but if i wanted to get another .sch.uk domain for our school am i able to do so?

    The reason i ask, and it sounds so stupid i know but at the moment we are getting the excuse from staff that they dont use there school email as they cannot remember the email address.

    our current domain is bhtc.sandwell.sch.uk am i able to get another domain name for example bhtc.sch.uk ? or would i have to just get a normal .co.uk

    James.
    We are in the process of getting our second .sch.uk domain name to reflect our bi-lingual school status.

    So we currently have: swansea.sch.uk which is our LEA.

    We are getting abertawe.sch.uk which is the Welsh name of our LEA.

    The English language one will point to the english side of our new website and the Welsh will point to the Welsh language side.

    However, we are only about to have email with the english domain name. Nobody has explained why. Anyone care to for me?

    Cheers

    GJE

  12. #27

    john's Avatar
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    I cannot see why you can only have the "english" email as it were, the new domain just needs its MX settings setting to the ones for the english domain and the mail server that deals with the english domains emails needs its settings adjusting to allow it to accept and send the mail for the welsh address. Obviously you would only normally be sending out against one address though but could publish both. I worked at a place that had emails as school.org.uk on the letterhead etc as its short and sweet but we also had school.lea.sch.uk which due to the school name was huuuuuuuuuge so we accepted mail to both and had accounts on both so it all worked fine and if you got them mixed it up it still came to my inbox etc but it was set to go out as school.lea.sch.uk

    (hope that lot makes sense!)

  13. Thanks to john from:

    garethedmondson (26th April 2009)

  14. #28

    garethedmondson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by john View Post
    I cannot see why you can only have the "english" email as it were, the new domain just needs its MX settings setting to the ones for the english domain and the mail server that deals with the english domains emails needs its settings adjusting to allow it to accept and send the mail for the welsh address. Obviously you would only normally be sending out against one address though but could publish both. I worked at a place that had emails as school.org.uk on the letterhead etc as its short and sweet but we also had school.lea.sch.uk which due to the school name was huuuuuuuuuge so we accepted mail to both and had accounts on both so it all worked fine and if you got them mixed it up it still came to my inbox etc but it was set to go out as school.lea.sch.uk

    (hope that lot makes sense!)
    Thanks John, I'll take that to the LEA and ask if we can have it.

    They use Exchange 2007 so hopefully it can be done.

    GJE

  15. #29

    john's Avatar
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    Should be a simple job for them, mine was in exchange and I have it set that the Accept list had both domains in it and then you choose which you want to appear as when you send out as you can only send out as one.

  16. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by deanc View Post
    not forgetting schools that change name due to the town going from three tier to two tier, must be more of an issue with a few northants schools becoming academies, although my understanding is that these will completely ignore the .sch.uk domain and do their own thing
    Some of the recent changes are a pain in the neck. You can only have one .sch.uk domain per school unless there is a special arrangement (the welsh names are one such arrangement and about time) so when you move from schoolname A to schoolname B you get a few months of running both before Nominet tell you to close the other one down.

    It is pretty easy to get most mail systems to accept alternative domains to drop into the equivalent mailboxes but some suppliers may charge for this so you get a school that merges and within 6 months their old domain will not accept emails, creating some havoc occasionally. Then, if you consider two schools merging you end up with some staff who cannot have their old email address and it all gets a tad political (2 S Smiths is one example I have seen elsewhere).

    In Northants we are farly lucky as there is yet another separate email system for head@, bursar@ and SENCO@ email addresses for official communication with schools, so if a school does naff up their domain we are still sorted. It just makes it difficult to get messages to other staff at times.

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