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BSF Thread, I (we) categorically do not want BSF Managed ICT in United Kingdom (UK) Specific Forums; ...
  1. #61

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    Quote Originally Posted by torledo View Post
    but surely they would have still needed a projector if they used your cheaper method ?
    if they didnt i would want some of them - lol

    my point was they paid £400 just for the visualiser

    Logitech B500 1.3MP Webcam - 960-000560 £34.30 ex VAT,

    best video conferencing experience. A 72-degree wide-angle lens allows everyone to be seen during small group video conferencing. A true 1.3-megapixel sensor provides rich, vibrant images.
    Video Resolution - 1280 x 1024pixels
    Frame Rates - 30Per Second


    http://www.cclonline.com/product-inf...346&tid=frooct

    this is what i would have done anyways or somthing like it that i could be sure would do at least 20fps at high res, because sods law says, they would use it once then never bother again

    Anyone considered putting up a satellite dish for their language block?
    Was thinking of doing this so they could record all foreign channels
    (gone a little of track from my orginal post- however any new IT we can put in that a RMS will not support the better)
    Last edited by sjpage10; 2nd April 2010 at 06:32 PM.

  2. #62
    torledo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sjpage10 View Post
    if they didnt i would want some of them - lol

    my point was they paid £400 just for the visualiser

    Logitech B500 1.3MP Webcam - 960-000560 £34.30 ex VAT,

    best video conferencing experience. A 72-degree wide-angle lens allows everyone to be seen during small group video conferencing. A true 1.3-megapixel sensor provides rich, vibrant images.
    Video Resolution - 1280 x 1024pixels
    Frame Rates - 30Per Second


    Buy Logitech B500 1.3MP Webcam960-000560 from CCL - Online Retailer of the Year 2008, 2007 & 2006 for laptops, desktops and computer hardware

    this is what i would have done anyways or somthing like it that i could be sure would do at least 20fps at high res, because sods law says, they would use it once then never bother again

    Anyone considered putting up a satellite dish for their language block?
    Was thinking of doing this so they could record all foreign channels
    (gone a little of track from my orginal post- however any new IT we can put in that a RMS will not support the better)
    ok, so when do they get the fixed projector to enable them to use their new visualiser ? Or is it a case of not enough left in the budget.

  3. #63

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    there are more people with knowledge of Microsoft based systems, than remote managed systems that use their own unique software
    The latter **are** Microsoft based systems. That they have bits of unique code where you have a bit of unique VBS, or they decided to use product X to to extend the management capabilities whereas you used product Y instead, really isn't very significant. That said I'm thinking of CC3, not the MSPified successor CC4 with it's disproportionately large, proprietory and opaque manglement layer.

    Amongst other things, one very clear message from this forum is that technical wheels are being reinvented over and over in the 1001 ways Windows (sorry *nix folk, but..) permits. In this sub-forum in particular we hear how such technical diversity is everso extremely very important which is a perfectly natural stance for anyone attempting to defend themselves from BSF, but I think that argument was lost years ago i.e. RM put their "one-size-fits-all" system into lots of schools and for the most part it was a reasonably good fit.

    Frustratingly, because I think it's all far too late now, instead of just bitching about that you lot could have blown it away i.e. figured out that you have a great deal in common, realised that the choice of X or Y is much of a muchness so let's just have X, and made an open "baseline" standard for a school Windows system with it's own unique code to compensate for some of those native deficiencies, plus documentation, best practice for integrating special/unique features that really are necessary in some places, made GD's "policies and procedures" nicely tuned to that system and so on. But no one wants to do that do they? You're not content unless it's your creation that does things your way.

  4. Thanks to PiqueABoo from:

    GrumbleDook (6th April 2010)

  5. #64


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    one very clear message from this forum is that technical wheels are being reinvented over and over in the 1001 ways Windows (sorry *nix folk, but..) permits
    It's usually windows that does the re-inventing, embrace, extend etc

  6. #65
    torledo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PiqueABoo View Post
    The latter **are** Microsoft based systems. That they have bits of unique code where you have a bit of unique VBS, or they decided to use product X to to extend the management capabilities whereas you used product Y instead, really isn't very significant. That said I'm thinking of CC3, not the MSPified successor CC4 with it's disproportionately large, proprietory and opaque manglement layer.

    Amongst other things, one very clear message from this forum is that technical wheels are being reinvented over and over in the 1001 ways Windows (sorry *nix folk, but..) permits. In this sub-forum in particular we hear how such technical diversity is everso extremely very important which is a perfectly natural stance for anyone attempting to defend themselves from BSF, but I think that argument was lost years ago i.e. RM put their "one-size-fits-all" system into lots of schools and for the most part it was a reasonably good fit.

    Frustratingly, because I think it's all far too late now, instead of just bitching about that you lot could have blown it away i.e. figured out that you have a great deal in common, realised that the choice of X or Y is much of a muchness so let's just have X, and made an open "baseline" standard for a school Windows system with it's own unique code to compensate for some of those native deficiencies, plus documentation, best practice for integrating special/unique features that really are necessary in some places, made GD's "policies and procedures" nicely tuned to that system and so on. But no one wants to do that do they? You're not content unless it's your creation that does things your way.
    So, are you saying that people should ready themselves and their skills into a new niche as BSF approaches, rather than trying to fight old battles ?

  7. #66
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    Thumbs down

    Quote Originally Posted by sjpage10 View Post
    Logitech B500 1.3MP Webcam - 960-000560 £34.30 ex VAT
    How about we set up a big 17in CRT, a fresnel lens and a really big white sheet so they can see the other party?

    Come on - expensive hardware has its place. I don't think anyone would question that. I think the message is that if this hardware is not purchased correctly (e.g. visualiser without a projector) then it will be wasted.

    Vidconf kit is valuable ... when it is used correctly, when it is not mis-purchased, and when there is a plan or strategy around its use.

  8. #67

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    Quote Originally Posted by PiqueABoo View Post
    <snip>. But no one wants to do that do they? You're not content unless it's your creation that does things your way.
    Pretty good points ... and I would like to point out that there is a difference between a choice in technology being open to allow for the curriculum to develop and the choice of technology needing to be left open to fit around the skills and decisions of IT managers. Every time I see that a choice in technology has been restricted due to the lack of willingness of IT Managers to adapt / do something new, the lack of training / CPD for IT managers to adapt and learn about different solutions or the lack of time to get used to new systems ... mainly down to lack of management from further up the chain ... it frustrates me.

    I keep going on about not being tied down to purely technical stuff, but making sure that you are accountable, are tied in with curriculum development, etc ... and this is one of the reasons why.

  9. #68
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    Just some facts from a bsf school:

    Our laptops will now cost £730 for a basic model(who knows what it will be next year!) - no need to contact 3 suppliers!
    Our NM has large chucks of his jobs taken away, so now will only be 'firefighting'
    The contract is for 10 YEARS with a review in 5 years; and the LA person responsible is retiring in 2, moron!
    10% of equipment must be locked away unused(so they can always produce something new and shiny in emergency; although after a few years unused it won't be new and shiny, will it?
    Our msp come to meetings but never take anything on board, they don't understand how IT is used here only what THEY are going to implement
    Oh, and they've never done service before (only hardware) but the building partner swung the bid

    You can see why anyone would be pesimistic about the result, and above all the comeback with such a long contract!

    I know of another school in the area in even worse situation - they have an expensive citrix kit with thin clients working beautifully and it will all be scrapped in favour of fat clients - msp have to have uniformity across schools! They even admitted to that school they can't better their kit and it will be a step back for them, so where is innovation?

  10. #69

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    I didn't think BSF and ICT innovation were allowed in the same sentance?

  11. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrumbleDook View Post
    Pretty good points ... and I would like to point out that there is a difference between a choice in technology being open to allow for the curriculum to develop and the choice of technology needing to be left open to fit around the skills and decisions of IT managers. Every time I see that a choice in technology has been restricted due to the lack of willingness of IT Managers to adapt / do something new, the lack of training / CPD for IT managers to adapt and learn about different solutions or the lack of time to get used to new systems ... mainly down to lack of management from further up the chain ... it frustrates me.
    It's the tail wagging the dog or the dog wagging the tail situation. As a Network Manager it frustrates me that I have to make decisions that will affect the curriculum, and not those in charge. As there is no suitable CPD for technical staff in our area I have little choice but to stick with what I know - This is why many of us are dependant on Microsoft products, because of familiarity and the ease of finding solutions for problems and incidents.

    Having said that, I do have £1000 a year in my budget to buy new innovations and test them out. It might not sond like much, but it does mean I get to play and learn about some new toys every so often.



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