Blog Comments

  1. 86bender's Avatar
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    Hi! I have recently found new soft for making 8 work station by using 1 PC. Does any body check this out.It is available here Friendly Seats - Muliply your PC! Can you recommend another soft like this (cheaper or free)))
  2. epsicot's Avatar
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    Just can't type '@'
  3. verygreenpc's Avatar
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    Terry, how're you getting on with the SoftXpand mate? Even if it's bad, lemmeknow and we'll try and help out. Filled in the lunch poll and realised I don't take lunch because I'm EduGeeking now!
  4. duportail's Avatar
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    Ok, thanks for the information.Than it would be nice if you and your partners would write on their websites that if the customers pushes the start button on their new Softxpand computer for x users, they are all in order regarding the Ms Windows xp licenses.
    I have my doubts :
    Review: MiniFrame SoftXpand Business - vnunet.com

    I will test this myself within a few weeks.
  5. verygreenpc's Avatar
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    Hey Multiuser,

    Some good points. The issue historically has been whether copies of the OS are created or whether the native resource of the OS is being maximised efficiently.

    Vera unless I am mistaken does not work for Microsoft. Our response came from Jackie Elleker, Licensing Specialist at M$ in the UK to our Gold partner MTB Computer Services, a corporate IT VAR.

    1 XP license per SoftXpand ecoware PC. Lovely.

    Kind regards,
    Col
  6. duportail's Avatar
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    Good day,
    I am still getting no clear answer regards the licensing.Ofcourse you can ship these computers with one or none xp license.But you give the rest of the responsability to the user.My question was simple:the pc is equipped with one windows xp, ok, but does the buyer needs additional xp licenses also?According the blog poster yes because he provides his licenses.Sure they cannot use CAL's because it's not windows server.And I think also no virtualistion licenses because you say on your website it's a mix of two things.So let the potentional buyer know if he needs to buy additional licenses or not.This is very important to calculate the total savings or TCO.As I see in the MS eula, the are not talking about license per cpu or pc, but license per session, so you need with your system one license per user.I staed this MVP already:
    "Multiple sessions to XP computer - Vera Noest [MVP]
    12-Feb-07 05:25:16
    You can't, XP is a single-user OS. You'll need a server OS like
    Windows 2003 for this.
    And yes, I know that there is 3rd party software which enables this,
    but you would still have to buy an XP license for every connecting
    user, apart from the 3rd part software."


    Just let us know:1 xp license per softxpand system for x users or 1 license per user ( so six users=6 xp licenses).
    I had the very same discussion with your partner in the Netherlands and he also could not give a clear answer.

    BTW: i am not a competitor because our systems are opensource, so the customer only choose closed or opensource.And Ncomputing is thin client soft, so that's another system.
    For the original poster:we do not use closed source in our systems, that's our policy of green computing.
  7. verygreenpc's Avatar
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    Hi Multiuser,

    We didn't aim to give the impression of aggression so please accept our apologies if this was misconstrued.

    MiniFrameUK intends that SoftXpand ecoware assist you in minimizing hardware deployment and support costs in a Multiseat computing environment. The end user via their reseller partners are solely responsible for any software licenses and licensing fees that may be required by third party software licensors. Please ensure that you obtain all necessary software licenses or check your existing software license agreements to ensure your continued compliance with the terms and conditions of such third party licensing agreements.

    All SoftXpand ecoware PCs shipped are preloaded with 1 copy of Windows XP as there is only 1 PC. We have already elsewhere on this forum posted Microsofts response that clearly indicated 1 copy of Windows XP, Vista, 7 etc is all that is required. This is because no additional devices with additional processing units are required.

    We think you have a fantastic solution and you should do well against NComputing where open source opportunities exist. If you do too well though, we'll release our own open source version! And we really did mean that we liked your new website.

    Although we compete against you, our goal I hope is the same; to minimise the embedded carbon in the IT sector by reducing the amount of PCs that need to be built, shipped, powered and disposed of. If we can save customers a few pounds too, then all the better.

    Over 10,000 SoftXpand ecoware PCs with 1 copy of the Windows operating system have been sold into the UK market.

    Kind regards,
    Col
  8. tmcd35's Avatar
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    Okay, I think I should respond to the last couple of posts before this turns into a slug fest.

    1) I'd be happy to try out the Debian Multiseat system IF you can include a version of WINE proven to work with all the Windows software we must run.

    This is the standard Linux conundrum. Once it is solved I bet a lot of Edugeekers will be lining up to implement Linux based systems.

    I have heard of one project that is combining Windows System Calls directly into the Linux Kernel - looks promising.

    2) Licencing. As you can see fro the specs above I am working on the basis that you need 1 Windows License per usable terminal. Even with this licensing model (and buying more Vista licenses than I actually need) both nComputing and SoftXpand appear cheaper per seat than regular standalone systems. See Prices above.

    For nComputing I've opted to use the Windows 2003 r2 SP2 license from our decomissioned Terminal Server, along with ths TS CALS, to license each seat in our Library

    For SoftXpand I've opted for Windows Vista Enterprise. The downgrade rights will allow me to use XP and Enterprise comes with 4 additional Windows Licenses for use in a virtual environment - eg. SoftXpand.

    Windows Vista OEM costs about £100 and the Vista Enterprise License was about £30 with another £15 for media. So £145 gets four seats fully licenses. Thats £36.25 per seat for Windows Licensing.
  9. duportail's Avatar
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    Do you need to be so agressive?There is no need to, i have never posted against you.Just state on your website and your partners websites how many windows (and other commercial software)licenses are needed.One per system or one per user.
    That's what I have from microsoft:
    This Section 1.3 does not grant you rights to access a Workstation
    Computer Session from any Device. A "Session" means any use of the
    Software that enables functionality similar to that available to an
    end user who is interacting with the Workstation Computer through any
    combination of input, output and display peripherals
    1.4 Remote Desktop/Remote Assistance/NetMeeting. The Software contains
    Remote Desktop, Remote Assistance, and NetMeeting technologies that
    enable the Software or applications installed on the Workstation
    Computer (sometimes referred to as a host device) to be accessed
    remotely from other Devices. You may use the Software's Remote Desktop
    feature (or other software which provides similar functionality for a
    similar purpose) to access a Workstation Computer Session from any
    Device provided you acquire a separate Software license for that
    Device

    Multiple sessions to XP computer - Vera Noest [MVP]
    12-Feb-07 05:25:16
    You can't, XP is a single-user OS. You'll need a server OS like
    Windows 2003 for this.
    And yes, I know that there is 3rd party software which enables this,
    but you would still have to buy an XP license for every connecting
    user, apart from the 3rd part software.

    Just tell me how many licenses(oem or retail windows xp) per machine for example six users
  10. verygreenpc's Avatar
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    Ah Multiuser,

    How've you been my dear? It's been a while since you posted against SoftXpand. Love your new home page by the way.

    Did you get out of bed the wrong side or did one of our partners take another order from you?

    We're windows 7 ready and have been for quote some time. I'm not sure we accept your argument that SoftXpand is inefficient, or that it only works with certain software. However.... from a legal perspective we think you should remove this page from your website [url=http://www.multiseatcomputer.be/index.php/software-for-multiseat-computer.html]software computer-sharing[/url] before our HQ in Israel and most certainly NComputing remove it for you.

    We're willing to go side by side with you on a test to define the pros and cons of your solution, against SoftXpand, and others in the Multiseat / Multiuser space. Answer me though how do you work with Windows, the most popular operating system of all time?

    You've just blatantly infringed the rules of this website too, however Terry's the sort of chap that would probably give your system a whirl as he genuinely carries an interest in Multiseating.
    Cheers,
    Col
    Updated 10th June 2009 at 05:54 PM by verygreenpc
  11. duportail's Avatar
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    These solutions are software solutions to transform a single-user single session (outdated)windows xp in multi-user-session.Windows xp(and later versions)is not made for that.They do not make use of the resources in a smart way.
    Ncomputing is thin client system :all is send trough the network.Softxpand is software multiseat virtualisation.Not efficient because you can only install certified programs and cpu and memory use is not optimal.And every user needs a full windows license.
    There is only one true hardware multiseat solution, and that comes from Linux.See
    Multiseat Computer-delen
    Up to twelve users with modern ubuntu 9.04 software with 3 d desktop.
    True multisession, multiuser.
  12. verygreenpc's Avatar
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    You'll be the next Mark at Oriel over speccing everything! Will you be buying via DT Systems?
  13. localzuk's Avatar
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    Hmmm... So NetBSD doesn't go for 'ease of use' then
  14. powdarrmonkey's Avatar
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    Strictly speaking, apt is only the package system on Debian-type distributions. Redhat has rpm, gentoo has portage, etc.
  15. p858snake's Avatar
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    But come the summer and this software can be installed ready to upset the little blighter in September. I'm actually half way through my £6000 consumables budget in just 2 months! Admittedly £400 was for this software
    But if you use the release stations in large commons areas such as the library you should save some because people actually have to go up and approve the job so people dosn't get wasted by accidently clicks and walk offs.
  16. BrianG's Avatar
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    You're right, I'd much rather put the 12K to good use and buy hardware and software that is going to be of more use, than hand it over to microsoft for Office. Open office is the way to go !

    I can understand, from the teachers point of view, they haven't had a techie for months and they find administering things using winsuite to be quite easy and agreeable but from a technical point of view it's a complete nightmare. I will be trying my best to get rid of it
  17. tmcd35's Avatar
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    Firstly Brian - Take a base ball bat and gently apply it to your heads head until he caves in and agrees how bad WinSuite is. Seriously, convince him that you need to move to Win7 ASAP to stay up with modern tech. Then, as an after thought, mention WinSuite is not Win7 compatible. Whatever you do, get rid of it!!!

    As for OpenOffice. To upgrade all machines to the current version of M$ Office would cost us £12k. Thankfully M$ only release new version every 3 years and we can skip versions. So £12k every 6 years. The problem is £12k is a computer suite! I'd rather replace old hardware than waist £12k on a piece of software we don't really need, do we?
  18. BrianG's Avatar
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    There is a very strong argument for using OpenOffice in schools. Unlike shifting the entire OS onto open source, which would scare most teaching staff to death, Openoffice, for the end user and not to technically minded, is very very similar to Office. It offers much of the same options and facilities and because you can save to an Office format there should be no compatability issues.

    How much a year would it save you? not having to go down the office route?
  19. BrianG's Avatar
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    I would dearly love to get rid of Winsuite at one of my schools but unfortunately the head teacher thinks it's brilliant. I hate it with a passion.
  20. Jay's Avatar
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    I used a Windows box with Hauppage Satellite card and some software built out of the Xbox Media Centre project. It was pretty good feature wise, although performance was slow in beta. Its now a full release so I might give it another go. MEDIAPORTAL - free media center - Home

    I also tried MythTV on a linux box which worked a lot faster but unfortunatly was a sod to configure (matching EPG XML from radio times took ages for 1000+ channels). It's capable of streaming video to a number of clients and can skip commercials though, although I've not used either feature. MythTV
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